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A case for full face?

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downunder
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Re: A case for full face?

Postby downunder » Thu Jan 10, 2019 3:47 am

RagingGrandpa wrote:
Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:58 pm
OzBungy wrote:
Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:09 am
The bucket effect from a full face helmet would be huge.
(From experience, I disagree - especially if we're taking about a wire grille, which has negligible water drag.)
RagingGrandpa wrote:
Mon Jan 07, 2019 8:49 pm
Bucket-effect:
No complaints here for either helmet. The wire grille of #1 has effectively no drag in the water; and I haven't had the sensation of #2 'pulling' on my neck in a wipeout.
Hmmm,

The more the stuff you have around your head the more chances to get the line caught on something you cant see...

You are playing with fire here but each to his own I guess.

Put it this way, I sprained my ankle. Simple injury. No worries, right?

Well, got the DVT, on blood thinners, and my kidneys failed...

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Re: A case for full face?

Postby merl » Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:05 pm

I just got a bunch of stitches on my forehead from what I presume was the nose of the board hitting me.
I'm wondering how many of the head injuries are caused by the nose of the board, as the board chases the rider down after a crash.
If that is the case then maybe we should be protecting the nose of the board with a foam bumper rather than going full darth vader.

I'm thinking of trying something along those lines at least.

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Re: A case for full face?

Postby ap888 » Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:22 pm

Really enjoy riding slow carving doing 360s ...etc ..super safe compared to high speed :thumb:

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Re: A case for full face?

Postby tomtom » Tue Feb 05, 2019 5:17 pm

To Merl - yea soft nose is good idea - i was proposing this earlier nobody react - could please anybody hurt while foiling specify which part of gear make contact - sort of shared database...
maybe its worth make new thread for this. Anyway full face is imo way overkill - and unproportional measure to presumed danger

ap888 - actualy most accident hapens at slow speed where board can catch you - or you "broke" foil under you . At higher speed you just fly faaaar from gear.

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Re: A case for full face?

Postby Flyboy » Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:40 am

merl wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:05 pm
I just got a bunch of stitches on my forehead from what I presume was the nose of the board hitting me.
I'm wondering how many of the head injuries are caused by the nose of the board, as the board chases the rider down after a crash.
If that is the case then maybe we should be protecting the nose of the board with a foam bumper rather than going full darth vader.

I'm thinking of trying something along those lines at least.
I've always wondered about surfboards/windsurfers/kitesurfboards that have really pointy noses. The added danger from this seems like a completely stupid idea, as rounding off the nose likely has zero effect on the performance of the board.

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Re: A case for full face?

Postby RagingGrandpa » Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:52 pm

merl wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:05 pm
I just got a bunch of stitches on my forehead from what I presume was the nose of the board hitting me.
I'm wondering how many of the head injuries are caused by the nose of the board, as the board chases the rider down after a crash.
Seems common... I was bloodied the same way way; others also:
Foil wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 7:37 am
plummet wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:53 am
It's hard to explain. When i started foiling the board would hunt me down and smack into me. Now, whenever I crash it doesn't. I think I have learned to master the art of a toe flick and dive as I exit the foil. Sends the foil in one direction while i go in the other.
I really don't know how to explain it.
I was warned about this when I first started just 12 months ago,
It worried me a little as it sounds so dangerous, however my sailing buddy who started 18 months before me, had this happen to him all the time,
his trips to hospital for glue or stitches made him a regular visitor, and this really put me off taking up the sport.
And regarding:
ap888 wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:22 pm
Really enjoy riding slow carving doing 360s ...etc ..super safe compared to high speed :thumb:
... I echo this: (mine was <20mph on 1150cm2 wing)
tomtom wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 5:17 pm
ap888 - actualy most accident hapens at slow speed where board can catch you - or you "broke" foil under you . At higher speed you just fly faaaar from gear.

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Re: A case for full face?

Postby TomW » Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:00 pm

When I learned 2 years ago, after 3 solo sessions, I took 4hrs of private lessons from Jonny on Isla de Holbox. At that point I couldn't even surface ride...
First session, I was raring to go. But he stopped on the beach and said wait minute, we have to go over some basics here on the beach.
1. Today your not going to fly. You're going to taxi around.
2. and learn how to fall off.

He explained that your instinct is to fall backwards and push with back foot and that's dangerous. ( I already had sliced up my wetsuit back home on session 3)
He told me to always fall forward and push down with front foot. I should even try to keep my front foot on the board as long as possible while falling. This turned out to be really important advice.
This has never failed. As long as your front foot is on the nose it's not going to fly into you.

Of course as you get better an you start risking a jack-knife fall then that needs a different fall technique.

If course, my confidence can be gone after next session and I fall onto the foil....But so far I've mostly had only a few bruises and small cuts on my feet and legs while being in the water with the foil trying to get going...

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Re: A case for full face?

Postby Flyboy » Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:21 pm

TomW wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:00 pm
When I learned 2 years ago, after 3 solo sessions, I took 4hrs of private lessons from Jonny on Isla de Holbox. At that point I couldn't even surface ride...
First session, I was raring to go. But he stopped on the beach and said wait minute, we have to go over some basics here on the beach.
1. Today your not going to fly. You're going to taxi around.
2. and learn how to fall off.

He explained that your instinct is to fall backwards and push with back foot and that's dangerous. ( I already had sliced up my wetsuit back home on session 3)
He told me to always fall forward and push down with front foot. I should even try to keep my front foot on the board as long as possible while falling. This turned out to be really important advice.
This has never failed. As long as your front foot is on the nose it's not going to fly into you.

Of course as you get better an you start risking a jack-knife fall then that needs a different fall technique.

If course, my confidence can be gone after next session and I fall onto the foil....But so far I've mostly had only a few bruises and small cuts on my feet and legs while being in the water with the foil trying to get going...
That's interesting. I never really had much success with trying to 'taxi around" - possibly because I was trying to do it in insufficient wind. Fighting to keep taxiing was what led to the unpleasant falls, when the board sort of buckles underneath you & you fall onto the foil. Once I was flying - however out of control - I was always able to pull off from the front of the board with the kite. I actually found this sort of instinctive. The bad news is, I crashed so often & so violently (with full-length mast) that after four sessions my trachea was so bruised from all the face plants, that I had difficulty swallowing for a couple of days after!

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Re: A case for full face?

Postby TomW » Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:40 pm

Flyboy,

I spent one 2hr session taxiing around, skimming surface, keeping upwind. Learning to get up. This was key learning step. It allowed me to go into taxi mode later.
The next session I was learning to lift to flying and land back to taxi mode. Up and down.
Then up 100m, then down to surface. Up-down. I was crashing a lot.
This was on smaller moses 550 wing and 93cm mast.
After those 2*2 hour sessions I was solo.
Then the body slam face plant phase started when I had to learn altitude control. That took 20-30 hours on the water. It was pretty brutal. My neck hurt a lot, a had a few headaches from what would call minor concussions. I am wearing helmet and impact vest and full wetsuit.
I never considered giving up. I was ( and still) totally hooked.
Around 40 hrs I learned how to fall and fall less. Was doing surface taxi turns from hour 10.
Then I got a 590 wing and learned flying gybes. Toeside was easier. More falling.
Then around 100 hours I got 633 wing and learned flying footswitch and started doing 1hr+ sessions with 2 falls.

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Re: A case for full face?

Postby tomtom » Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:48 pm

What is jack-knife fall ? Never heard that


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