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Moses 2019-2020-2021

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dave1986
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby dave1986 » Sun Dec 20, 2020 2:54 pm

grigorib wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 11:59 am
I rode 720 (same as 718 except for surf fuselage) and 637. The 637 is way faster. 720 has much better lowend but is fairly thick and slow.
I’d say 671 would be very similar to 645. If you’re looking for slower/lightwindier, get the 800
How does the W720 compare with the W800 for kite-foiling?

W720 vs W800 : Low-end / Top-end/ maneuverability... The SAB website suggests the W800 is slightly faster but also equally maneuverable. Do you agree?

Which would be best for long distance straight-line fast cruising?

grigorib
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby grigorib » Sun Dec 20, 2020 5:55 pm

dave1986 wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 2:54 pm
grigorib wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 11:59 am
I rode 720 (same as 718 except for surf fuselage) and 637. The 637 is way faster. 720 has much better lowend but is fairly thick and slow.
I’d say 671 would be very similar to 645. If you’re looking for slower/lightwindier, get the 800
How does the W720 compare with the W800 for kite-foiling?

W720 vs W800 : Low-end / Top-end/ maneuverability... The SAB website suggests the W800 is slightly faster but also equally maneuverable. Do you agree?

Which would be best for long distance straight-line fast cruising?
When I rode 720 I compared it back to back with 683s. It felt way more stable, just like 800 vs 679. When tried with large 450 stabilizer it felt like it has almost same lowend as 683s but with 325 it instantly felt that I need more speed to go with it, again, compared back to back.

If 718 popped up when 720 became available - in May 2019, I’d certainly have one and wouldn’t need to wait for 695.

What bugs me in 720/718 design - pointed down wingtips. Those will go apart and away pretty soon, upon first few rubs on the bottom.

What I love about 800 - race DNA. It is scaled up 637/645/671 wing and it rides very stable. 800 is not a thin wing, so it won’t fly as fast as 637/645/671, at least its cruising speed is lower, but again - the lowend is pretty good and is very adequate for 840 sq.cm wing.

As of maneuverability- never once I felt that 800 is somehow handicapped in means of squeezing a tight turn.

I felt that 720 and 683s top ends were comparable, both not as high as with 800.

TL;DR 720/718 have damage-prone wingtips and I prefer 800 which is well maneuverable, fast and lightwindish
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dave1986
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby dave1986 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:20 am

handy wrote:
Tue Dec 15, 2020 1:33 pm
On the orderform , it says clearly 1450 cm2
There seems to be some contradiction here... 1450cm² or 1650cm² ???
SmartSelect_20201221-101853_Instagram.jpg

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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby handy » Mon Dec 21, 2020 12:00 pm

This is the original orderform for preorder 2021 coming from Moses SAB.

Image
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby handy » Mon Dec 21, 2020 12:12 pm

Did just see zhis now , same wing for windfoiling is 1700 cm2 so maybe there is some confusion at Moses . Will ask them .
20201221_070912.jpg
20201221_070912.jpg (64.73 KiB) Viewed 625 times
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grigorib
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Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/101cm masts with 800/425 695/425 637/420 1000/421 wingsets, 36" Woody, Slingshot Dwarfcraft Micro 3'6" 2019-2020, MBS Comp 95x

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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby grigorib » Mon Dec 21, 2020 12:43 pm

Higher aspect than 790, about same area. It will completely replace the 790.

grigorib
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Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/101cm masts with 800/425 695/425 637/420 1000/421 wingsets, 36" Woody, Slingshot Dwarfcraft Micro 3'6" 2019-2020, MBS Comp 95x

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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby grigorib » Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:54 pm

With all the respect to high aspect wings the 800/900/1000 are a bit impractical because of huge wingspan and increasing root chord for kite fuselage mountable wings would be something I’d love to see. A bit of additional area for heavier riders makes great sense.

I’m really done with heavier/bulkier surf fuselages and 679/950 wings’ tails show that the space and weight there are somewhat wasted.

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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby fluidity » Mon Dec 21, 2020 6:06 pm

grigorib wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:54 pm
With all the respect to high aspect wings the 800/900/1000 are a bit impractical because of huge wingspan and increasing root chord for kite fuselage mountable wings would be something I’d love to see. A bit of additional area for heavier riders makes great sense.

I’m really done with heavier/bulkier surf fuselages and 679/950 wings’ tails show that the space and weight there are somewhat wasted.
Or ditch the fuselage and connect the mast directly to the wing, my latest design :D
viewtopic.php?t=2408517&p=1121976
600mm wingspan x 450 chord. Looks like enough wind to test it xmas day.
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grigorib
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Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, Turbine 9m, SST 4/5/7m, UFO 5/7/9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m

Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/101cm masts with 800/425 695/425 637/420 1000/421 wingsets, 36" Woody, Slingshot Dwarfcraft Micro 3'6" 2019-2020, MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Moses 80cm alu mast $260
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby grigorib » Mon Dec 21, 2020 6:38 pm

fluidity wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 6:06 pm
grigorib wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:54 pm
With all the respect to high aspect wings the 800/900/1000 are a bit impractical because of huge wingspan and increasing root chord for kite fuselage mountable wings would be something I’d love to see. A bit of additional area for heavier riders makes great sense.

I’m really done with heavier/bulkier surf fuselages and 679/950 wings’ tails show that the space and weight there are somewhat wasted.
Or ditch the fuselage and connect the mast directly to the wing, my latest design :D
viewtopic.php?t=2408517&p=1121976
600mm wingspan x 450 chord. Looks like enough wind to test it xmas day.
Few years back I tried exactly that with H4 wing which has similar shape. Way smoother without the stabilizer, way more nimble. Cool to try but wouldn’t ride it like that.

That monowing seems to be nice design, curious to hear how it rides
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dave1986
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby dave1986 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 9:19 pm

grigorib wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:54 pm
With all the respect to high aspect wings the 800/900/1000 are a bit impractical because of huge wingspan and increasing root chord for kite fuselage mountable wings would be something I’d love to see. A bit of additional area for heavier riders makes great sense.

I’m really done with heavier/bulkier surf fuselages and 679/950 wings’ tails show that the space and weight there are somewhat wasted.
Presumably if you made a wing with a bigger root chord than the kite fuselage then it would only be able to fit on the surf fuselage and would need a small tail (Like the W679 or W720 with small tail).

The other option would be to make a 3rd fuselage type which had a root chord size half-way between the kite fuselage and surf fuselage - but then this just gets complicated!

Personally I'd rather have just 2 fuselage types and put up with the little wing tails like 679 and 720 wings)


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