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Moses 2019-2020-2021

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francis luengo
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby francis luengo » Wed Jan 20, 2021 10:33 am

Any news about the new 91 mast?

dave1986
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby dave1986 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:23 pm

francis luengo wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 10:33 am
Any news about the new 91 mast?
I heard rumour they are releasing a 92cm mast with similar stiffer construction to the 72 and 82cm masts.
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Foil
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Style: improving kite foiler since 2017
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101cm + 91cm Moses Carbon masts
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby Foil » Wed Jan 20, 2021 2:44 pm

dave1986 wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:23 pm
francis luengo wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 10:33 am
Any news about the new 91 mast?
I heard rumour they are releasing a 92cm mast with similar stiffer construction to the 72 and 82cm masts.
I heard that to.
and then I had to stop myself trying to pre-order one after I thought it through after being the owner of the 82cm mast, twice!

Has anybody else tried to max-out the speed on the newish Moses 82cm mast, I have compared back to back with the standard construction moses masts, and have found the 82 carbon is a tad slower, feels draggy at high speed, even starts to complain if you try to push past the dragy feeling, faint hum you can hear and feel, I did look back a few times as it feels like it had picked up a small bit of weed or plastic bag,
I have had 2 of the new 82cm masts and they were exactly the same at the top end speed limit,
I have now changed to the wood core standard 91cm carbon moses mast, (same price) and will stick with that instead as my "short mast" alongside my wood core 101 carbon moses mast,
the 91moses carbon is the standard thinner profile moses offering, it is faster than the 82, no humming, smoother!
for normal freeriding, sometimes with fast wings, its just better,
the 3 year old 91 carbon that I had felt like a soft length of noodle in turbulent water with a big wing, this new one feels just fine.

It should have been obvious to me the 82 would be a tad slower, it is much wider, maybe a little thicker?(I did not actually measure the thickness)
Just a heads up really, to guys like me that might not realise that there is a price to pay if you choose the stronger stiffer 82 mast for fast freeriding, and if the new 92 is made to the same spec then maybe it will be the same.

Maybe these wider masts are best left for the boards they were aimed at- the wing foil boards and the like that use the massive wings.

grigorib
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby grigorib » Wed Jan 20, 2021 3:01 pm

^^^^Lower top speed makes sense. 72 and 82 are much thicker surf masts, therefore sturdier but slower.
Also the geometry of 72-82 masts is different (no rake) and would require to change position of the mast on the board (moving mast back)

In this picture you can see 80cm aluminum, 82,91,101,105 carbon masts and thickness of 82 stands out right away.
Again, it’s just fine for low speed surf setup
Attachments
AD3DD8EB-8B3A-4BBC-9BA5-0C1A0FA8B78C.jpeg
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Foil
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Local Beach: New Brighton- nr Liverpool. Open sea with big low tide lagoon
Favorite Beaches: New Brighton, Rhosneigr, Fleetwood, Newbrough
lake Como (Italy)
Style: improving kite foiler since 2017
Gear: Groove Skates 110 and 120 custom graphics and volume 2021 editions
101cm + 91cm Moses Carbon masts
Moses- 633/483 on a 701 fuse
Moses- 718 /421 on the smaller lighter kite fuse
Ozone Hyperlink V1 ultra light 5mtr
Ozone V2 Hyperlink 7mtr + 9mtr
Ozone Chrono V4 foil kite 11mtr, red
duotone click bar 2020, custom lines
duotone 2021 click bar (waiting for delivery)
ION B3 seat harness, now waiting 7 months for delivery:o
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby Foil » Wed Jan 20, 2021 4:05 pm

the problem is in the words used on the moses web site, the 82 mast sits in the kite surf section as a mast option for everyone,
and I know I had read the quote about amazing speed, which is still there.
in my view it's not that amazing, it's a bit disappointing.
It clearly has a top speed, the standard masts don't

here is the info cut from the page in the kitesurf masts available tab.
------cut and paste
Full-carbon mast with a high density wood core. The shape and the profile of mast M82 are designed to have one of the stiffest carbon mast on the market, with an exceptional torsional strength. Despite the extra thickness this mast still has amazing speed.
----------
again this post is here to give potential buyers a heads up on what they might need to think about.

grigorib
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Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/101cm masts with 800/425 695/425 637/420 1000/421 wingsets, 36" Woody, Slingshot Dwarfcraft Micro 3'6" 2019-2020, MBS Comp 95x

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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby grigorib » Wed Jan 20, 2021 4:19 pm

Moses answered comments on their web page few years back in tune of “we do carbon, web design is not what we do”. I’m sure it’s not that expensive to maintain accurate descriptions but Moses web page has been improving and has more to improve.
To me it looks like a case of web designer not having a clue about products and getting little guidance from tech folks.
There were cases when wing area changed from year to year- 590 was claimed as 633 sq.cm and as 650 sq.cm, 683s was claimed to be 1005 sq.cm and 679 is listed as 990 sq.cm being exactly same wing, 1150 fuselage was listed as 1100 etc. and multiple unchallenged copy-paste is obvious there too.

Bottom line I take information from Moses web page with a grain of salt. And had trouble communicating to Moses to address those.

In words of Olivia Newton-John’s “Grease” character “you gotta shape up, cause I need my foils, and my mind is set on you”

Wazza Foil
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby Wazza Foil » Thu Jan 21, 2021 6:09 am

I think I have a 950 on the way.
Based on above grigorib comments who knows what specs it will be.
One thing for sure it will be shiny new.
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grigorib
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Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; La Ventana; SPI; Hood River; Tawas, MI
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Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/101cm masts with 800/425 695/425 637/420 1000/421 wingsets, 36" Woody, Slingshot Dwarfcraft Micro 3'6" 2019-2020, MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Moses 80cm alu mast $260
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby grigorib » Thu Jan 21, 2021 7:26 pm

I’m curious about thickness of 950. I’d expect it to be at most 790/1100 since 873 was too fat to go fast and too low aspect to glide which probably led to its demise.
One thing I expect is to be plenty 790-1100 wings for sale soon by folks who get 950 :)

dave1986
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby dave1986 » Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:13 pm

My assumption is that the 873 wing is not particularly good for wind sports because of it's thick profile making it slow.

However I would have thought the 873 was the best Moses wing for early lift for small wave surf and SUP foiling? Has anyone used it SUP or surf foiling to confirm this?

BOEMIX
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Re: Moses 2019-2020-2021

Postby BOEMIX » Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:34 pm

The 873 is my main wingfoil. I recently upgraded 71 mast to 72 C40, and what a difference! control over foil is 100x100 better and the strange spinout I had before is completely gone!

My feelings are that 873 is too slow for anything but slow mushy surf. Yesterday I had the chance to ride in 20 knot plus winds, and chest high fast waves, and I have to steer the wing almost ever to keep up with wave speed, so still no free wing wave riding for me :( but take it with a grain of salt, I was just surviving in that conditions, maybe just my lack of skill.

Sooner or later I think I'm going to upgrade to 1100.
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