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Moses 2019-2020

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Foil
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Moses- 633
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby Foil » Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:07 am

airsurfer wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 12:43 am
The 720 is fast what makes it great and much better than 633 and 683 is glide upwind ability stability low drag and acceleration without giving up much low end (depending on the stabilizer you choose) So far for me it's the wing I've been waiting for Moses to make. I've owned all of the Moses wings except the Havok front wing.
I have used Steves 720 set up (Sfollis) above (that is his name in real life you know! Steve Follis, great car number plate I am thinking)
anyways I have used his set up on around 5 occasions now, and wanted to like as it is so fast, and i could not really detect much if any any loss of lift, but, and this was the decider for me, It was hard work for me to keep it running fast, the effort required to keep things smooth and stable was for me too much,
both feet strapped down was important to be able to push for speed and stability, i concluded the wing was better than me, maybe next year i will like it more,
but for now my 633 is my friend for life,
jumping off the 720 and straight back on the 633 was joyous :roll:
however steve loves his set up, which he did have to grow into (tuning the stab) to master it, but he is 20 years younger than me, a lot lot fitter and naturally a true athlete, suited much more to the 720,
maybe if I could do race turns I would have a different views on its suitability for my "style" :thumb:
These users thanked the author Foil for the post:
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grigorib
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Posts: 2107
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; Tawas, MI; SPI; La Ventana
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, SST 5m, Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m
Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/105cm masts with 590/330 695/425 683s/450 wingsets, Tim's 36" "woody", Slingshot Micro 3'6", MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot RPM 11m 2018 $600, Core XR4 10m $900, Core XR4 13.5m $980, Core XR4 17m $1075, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530, 2019 Slingshot Guardian 17" brand new $260, 2018 Slingshot Guardian 20" bar $190
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby grigorib » Tue Dec 10, 2019 2:44 pm

Foil wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:07 am
I have used Steves 720 set up (Sfollis) above (that is his name in real life you know! Steve Follis, great car number plate I am thinking)
anyways I have used his set up on around 5 occasions now, and wanted to like as it is so fast, and i could not really detect much if any any loss of lift, but, and this was the decider for me, It was hard work for me to keep it running fast, the effort required to keep things smooth and stable was for me too much,
both feet strapped down was important to be able to push for speed and stability, i concluded the wing was better than me, maybe next year i will like it more,
but for now my 633 is my friend for life,
jumping off the 720 and straight back on the 633 was joyous :roll:
however steve loves his set up, which he did have to grow into (tuning the stab) to master it, but he is 20 years younger than me, a lot lot fitter and naturally a true athlete, suited much more to the 720,
maybe if I could do race turns I would have a different views on its suitability for my "style" :thumb:
Which stabilizer did you use with 720?

Foil
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 926
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:44 pm
Kiting since: 2000
Local Beach: New brighton beach-Derby pool end,Wallasey, near Liverpool
Favorite Beaches: holidays - Flag beach fuerteventura
Home - New Brighton,Rhosneigr, Ainsdale, Fleetwood, Newbrough
Style: improving foiler.
Gear: Groove Skate 130, naked carbon,gold stripes
Moses T38 black, 2020 edition
Indiana foil 120cm
101cm amd 82cm Moses Carbon masts
Moses- 633
Ozone V2 Hyperlink 7mtr
Ozone Chrono V3 UL foil kites - 9/11/13
Ozone Hyperlink V1 ultra light 5mtr
Ozone compact V4 bars,click in, 15-23 mtr lines
massive grin
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby Foil » Tue Dec 10, 2019 4:43 pm

grigorib wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 2:44 pm
Foil wrote:
Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:07 am
I have used Steves 720 set up (Sfollis) above (that is his name in real life you know! Steve Follis, great car number plate I am thinking)
anyways I have used his set up on around 5 occasions now, and wanted to like as it is so fast, and i could not really detect much if any any loss of lift, but, and this was the decider for me, It was hard work for me to keep it running fast, the effort required to keep things smooth and stable was for me too much,
both feet strapped down was important to be able to push for speed and stability, i concluded the wing was better than me, maybe next year i will like it more,
but for now my 633 is my friend for life,
jumping off the 720 and straight back on the 633 was joyous :roll:
however steve loves his set up, which he did have to grow into (tuning the stab) to master it, but he is 20 years younger than me, a lot lot fitter and naturally a true athlete, suited much more to the 720,
maybe if I could do race turns I would have a different views on its suitability for my "style" :thumb:
Which stabilizer did you use with 720?
good point, i have tried a few different combinations of shims and I think 2 different stabilizers, the 483 was one, and I think I tried the 450 as well but not sure now, steve has a few rear stabs but i cant be sure if i did try that one.

grigorib
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Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; Tawas, MI; SPI; La Ventana
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, SST 5m, Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m
Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/105cm masts with 590/330 695/425 683s/450 wingsets, Tim's 36" "woody", Slingshot Micro 3'6", MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot RPM 11m 2018 $600, Core XR4 10m $900, Core XR4 13.5m $980, Core XR4 17m $1075, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530, 2019 Slingshot Guardian 17" brand new $260, 2018 Slingshot Guardian 20" bar $190
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby grigorib » Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:21 pm

483 and shimmed 450 ride quite similarly. It’s the 325 which did huge difference for me lacking pitch stability with 720

I’m stoked to try 695/425 combo

oregonkiter
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby oregonkiter » Wed Dec 11, 2019 12:34 am

I'm really liking the 483/450 combo. Did not shim 450. Just did plugnplay. With this setup if there is less low end vs 633 I sure don't notice it.

cwood
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby cwood » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:10 pm

Did Moses fix the fuse for the 633 to make it more compatible with kiteboards and weight distribution. The first gen one I had created issues with not begin able to get weight far enough forward.

grigorib
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Posts: 2107
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; Tawas, MI; SPI; La Ventana
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, SST 5m, Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m
Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/105cm masts with 590/330 695/425 683s/450 wingsets, Tim's 36" "woody", Slingshot Micro 3'6", MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot RPM 11m 2018 $600, Core XR4 10m $900, Core XR4 13.5m $980, Core XR4 17m $1075, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530, 2019 Slingshot Guardian 17" brand new $260, 2018 Slingshot Guardian 20" bar $190
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby grigorib » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:15 pm

First generation of 633 was heavier. There was no geometry change and even switching from 749 to 710 fuselage didn't have any effect on weight distribution of the rider. Using 450 stabilizer, in my experience moved weight even further forward.

Eventually I have two positions on the board for mast placement - one for kite wings setup, another for surf wings. Not an issue but paon for those with static placement

cwood
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby cwood » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:21 pm

grigorib wrote:
Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:15 pm
First generation of 633 was heavier. There was no geometry change and even switching from 749 to 710 fuselage didn't have any effect on weight distribution of the rider. Using 450 stabilizer, in my experience moved weight even further forward.

Eventually I have two positions on the board for mast placement - one for kite wings setup, another for surf wings. Not an issue but paon for those with static placement
I had 483 and needed to shim the mast to fuse to get it balanced (even having tracks on the board to mast mount). Ended up selling it because it seemed kludgy.

dave1986
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby dave1986 » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:29 pm

cwood wrote:
Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:10 pm
Did Moses fix the fuse for the 633 to make it more compatible with kiteboards and weight distribution. The first gen one I had created issues with not begin able to get weight far enough forward.
It's only an issue if you have a board with fixed mast mounting position. If your board has rails like most do nowadays then you just mount the mast towards the tail.
Alternatively you can buy a shim for the rear stabilizer which fixes the issue. SK Shapes sell them here : https://www.skshapes.com/shop/accessoires/
And I think FamousFrank.de too

cwood
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Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby cwood » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:32 pm

dave1986 wrote:
Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:29 pm
cwood wrote:
Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:10 pm
Did Moses fix the fuse for the 633 to make it more compatible with kiteboards and weight distribution. The first gen one I had created issues with not begin able to get weight far enough forward.
It's only an issue if you have a board with fixed mast mounting position. If your board has rails like most do nowadays then you just mount the mast towards the tail.
Alternatively you can buy a shim for the rear stabilizer which fixes the issue. SK Shapes sell them here : https://www.skshapes.com/shop/accessoires/
And I think FamousFrank.de too
ya, have tracks, still not enough to go without a shim. The stab shim results in a less smooth ride in my opinion because you are flying without neutral trim.


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