Contact   Imprint   Advertising   Guidelines

Moses 2019-2020

A forum dedicated to Hydrofoil riders
grigorib
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2228
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Kiting since: 2009
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; La Ventana, SPI; Tawas, MI
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, SST 5m, Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m

Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/82/91/105cm masts with 590/330 695/425 683s/450 679/483 wingsets, Tim's 36" woody, Slingshot Dwarfcraft Micro 3'6" 2019-2020, MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530

Moses 590/647/330 $740, Moses 633/749/483 $790, Moses 683s/749/483 $890, 75cm alu mast $200, 80cm alu mast $260
.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 146 times
Been thanked: 193 times

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby grigorib » Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:14 pm

joekitetime wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:08 pm
...
Quick question on shimming. I tried shimming the fuselage. I assume that is that you mean (shimming down would be a 1mm washer at the foreward bolt, correct?) You don't actually put the shim on the stabilizer?

I've managed to ride the 590, but never have been comfortable on it. Others seem to love it. Hoping to really like that 695 but we shall see...
I shim stabilizer adding a washer (or shim) between stabilizer and fuselage, on the front/rear bolt, depending whether you want to point stabilizer a tad down or up

I’ve had “second 590 sold in US” in January 2018 and I enjoyed it royally. But then also came 633, 683s and they’ve taken a good share of time on water. 695 and 590 mast positions were about the same and my buddy flies 590 exclusively so there were more than one person dealing with track challenge on 2020 Micro. And folks who ride surf wings with 450 on 2020 Micro - they can’t be happier with track position.
These users thanked the author grigorib for the post:
joekitetime (Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:22 pm)
Rating: 10%

kuit
Rare Poster
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 8:09 am
Gear: 9m & 12m Kitech Free RS
15m Kitech Free RS UL
12m Ocean Rodeo Flite gen 6
10m Ozone Enduro V2
7m Ocean Rodeo Prodigy gen 4
Moses Comet 111 / Moses Fluente 91 / 590 & 633 Frontwings / 330 & 483 Stabilisers
Moses T60 / T38
Ten The Mark
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby kuit » Wed Feb 05, 2020 7:40 pm

bigwave wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 7:48 pm
Here's a couple pics of the 683 and 679 wings together. The first pic is the 679 on top of the 683. They are IMO identical. The distance from the leading edge to the tip is exactly the same on both wings. Sorry , I do not have the 421 Stabilizer in stock for a comparison.
thumbnail_IMG_5173.jpg
Hi Bigwave,

Did you compare the 679 and the 683? If yes, are there any differences?

grigorib
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2228
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Kiting since: 2009
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; La Ventana, SPI; Tawas, MI
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, SST 5m, Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m

Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/82/91/105cm masts with 590/330 695/425 683s/450 679/483 wingsets, Tim's 36" woody, Slingshot Dwarfcraft Micro 3'6" 2019-2020, MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530

Moses 590/647/330 $740, Moses 633/749/483 $790, Moses 683s/749/483 $890, 75cm alu mast $200, 80cm alu mast $260
.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 146 times
Been thanked: 193 times

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby grigorib » Wed Feb 05, 2020 9:14 pm

To me it sounds they manually round tips of 683s from old mould and cut off 2mm on each end which produces the 679. Look, even the 3D rendered picture of 679 everyone uses on their webstores is not accurate and doesn't sow a little tail in the back.

max
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 598
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2002 1:00 am
Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 4 times

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby max » Wed Feb 05, 2020 9:30 pm

kuit wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 7:40 pm
bigwave wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 7:48 pm
Here's a couple pics of the 683 and 679 wings together. The first pic is the 679 on top of the 683. They are IMO identical. The distance from the leading edge to the tip is exactly the same on both wings. Sorry , I do not have the 421 Stabilizer in stock for a comparison.
thumbnail_IMG_5173.jpg
Hi Bigwave,

Did you compare the 679 and the 683? If yes, are there any differences?

they are the same wing. run a tape over the width and see that neither are the stated 683 or 679 width.

User avatar
Adventure Logs
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 891
Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:18 pm
Local Beach: Punta del Diablo, Uruguay
Favorite Beaches: Durban, SA
Corpus Christi
Gear: Flysurfer, Moses, Groove, Slinghot, Nobile, Zeeko
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 19 times
Been thanked: 48 times
Contact:

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby Adventure Logs » Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:46 am

grigorib wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 6:20 pm
So I did a week and a half in La Ventana. Whole time I wasn't tempted to assemble the twintip I brought and I was secretly hoping not to use 9m but ended up using it with 30m lines on Jan 24th which was a light day and only racers were out besides couple LEI riders plus three of us at Pelican reef
Foil...foil...foil it was all the time. Nice break from Midwest January.

I demoed some foils and kites on the trip and here are my takeaways:

first thing first - 2020 695 wing
the wing is about 20% larger than 590, same thickness, has better lowend and lower plane speed compared to 590. Unlike larger 633/683s wings you can bring it to stall, but it stalls at much lower speed compared to other kite wings and would make it great lowend expansion for anyone riding kite wings. I pushed it to about 26 MPH speed which is not much but also I was riding small kites, not aiming at top speed. Due to straight leading edge the wing will suck in OBX and anywhere with seaweeds present and collecting onto wing. So for that one reason it won't be my "the only wing" if I had to choose one. Great otherwise!

Second experience - 420 stabilizer
While riding the race stabilizer I stated cursing a bit for not having it earlier as it felt superior to standard 330 and made me wonder why 330 does need to exist to start with. The 420 improved pitch and roll stability, increased front foot pressure and allowed to move the mast an inch back and maybe even helped lowend (but not significantly). It allowed to use 590 on 2020 Dwarfcraft without having to drill mast plate holes and without need to shim the stabilizer.

two above 695/420 combo - not sure if Gunnar put them two together by chance, or by intent to move stance forward, or because he knows how awesome race stabilizers are - regardless 695 with race stabilizer is a smart idea and 695/330 is less so.

Next one - shimming. Not the first time but played with it more
I've been shimming the 450 stabilizer (pointing it 2 degrees up) to move my stance 2" back on my 36" woody board which doesn't have tracks. This time on contrary I had to shim 330 stabilizer down to be able to ride 590/695 on 2020 Dwarfcraft (not enough tracks space in front). Shimming stabilizer by couple of degrees down increased front foot pressure and corrected the stance compensating for mast position. Shimming down improved lowend and lowered average speed a bit.

One more - 32" KS board with 633 wing, 420 stabilizer and Stringy's fuselage (thanks to Rick)
I remember that moment years ago when I was choosing between 4'6" and 3'6" Dwarfcraft and was talked out by store from buying the small one because "it's for really advanced riders". I got the 4'6" and it was a mistake. Rode 3'6" for couple of years, the 2019 was ridden mostly on 36" board but I had my doubts about 32". It does look tiny and it weigh nothing but once you fly up, you're good. I was surprised how 420 kite race stabilizer and custom fuselage played along to keep foot position still very reasonable on a board that doesn't have tracks. Nice ride and I think I owe Rick experience of riding 683s.

Other experience was to ride 4/6/8m Ghosts (thanks to Casey and Neal) and 5m Ozone Reo (thanks to Steve) but that is for a discussion out of this thread if anyone is interested.
Hey I’m down in La Ventana right now. Where did you demo from? I’d love to try a super short board.

grigorib
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2228
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Kiting since: 2009
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; La Ventana, SPI; Tawas, MI
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, SST 5m, Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m

Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/82/91/105cm masts with 590/330 695/425 683s/450 679/483 wingsets, Tim's 36" woody, Slingshot Dwarfcraft Micro 3'6" 2019-2020, MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530

Moses 590/647/330 $740, Moses 633/749/483 $790, Moses 683s/749/483 $890, 75cm alu mast $200, 80cm alu mast $260
.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 146 times
Been thanked: 193 times

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby grigorib » Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:33 am

Adventure Logs wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:46 am
grigorib wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 6:20 pm
So I did a week and a half in La Ventana. Whole time I wasn't tempted to assemble the twintip I brought and I was secretly hoping not to use 9m but ended up using it with 30m lines on Jan 24th which was a light day and only racers were out besides couple LEI riders plus three of us at Pelican reef
Foil...foil...foil it was all the time. Nice break from Midwest January.

I demoed some foils and kites on the trip and here are my takeaways:

first thing first - 2020 695 wing
the wing is about 20% larger than 590, same thickness, has better lowend and lower plane speed compared to 590. Unlike larger 633/683s wings you can bring it to stall, but it stalls at much lower speed compared to other kite wings and would make it great lowend expansion for anyone riding kite wings. I pushed it to about 26 MPH speed which is not much but also I was riding small kites, not aiming at top speed. Due to straight leading edge the wing will suck in OBX and anywhere with seaweeds present and collecting onto wing. So for that one reason it won't be my "the only wing" if I had to choose one. Great otherwise!

Second experience - 420 stabilizer
While riding the race stabilizer I stated cursing a bit for not having it earlier as it felt superior to standard 330 and made me wonder why 330 does need to exist to start with. The 420 improved pitch and roll stability, increased front foot pressure and allowed to move the mast an inch back and maybe even helped lowend (but not significantly). It allowed to use 590 on 2020 Dwarfcraft without having to drill mast plate holes and without need to shim the stabilizer.

two above 695/420 combo - not sure if Gunnar put them two together by chance, or by intent to move stance forward, or because he knows how awesome race stabilizers are - regardless 695 with race stabilizer is a smart idea and 695/330 is less so.

Next one - shimming. Not the first time but played with it more
I've been shimming the 450 stabilizer (pointing it 2 degrees up) to move my stance 2" back on my 36" woody board which doesn't have tracks. This time on contrary I had to shim 330 stabilizer down to be able to ride 590/695 on 2020 Dwarfcraft (not enough tracks space in front). Shimming stabilizer by couple of degrees down increased front foot pressure and corrected the stance compensating for mast position. Shimming down improved lowend and lowered average speed a bit.

One more - 32" KS board with 633 wing, 420 stabilizer and Stringy's fuselage (thanks to Rick)
I remember that moment years ago when I was choosing between 4'6" and 3'6" Dwarfcraft and was talked out by store from buying the small one because "it's for really advanced riders". I got the 4'6" and it was a mistake. Rode 3'6" for couple of years, the 2019 was ridden mostly on 36" board but I had my doubts about 32". It does look tiny and it weigh nothing but once you fly up, you're good. I was surprised how 420 kite race stabilizer and custom fuselage played along to keep foot position still very reasonable on a board that doesn't have tracks. Nice ride and I think I owe Rick experience of riding 683s.

Other experience was to ride 4/6/8m Ghosts (thanks to Casey and Neal) and 5m Ozone Reo (thanks to Steve) but that is for a discussion out of this thread if anyone is interested.
Hey I’m down in La Ventana right now. Where did you demo from? I’d love to try a super short board.
Indiana Slingshot ambassador had a demo day in January. And other folks had the rest of gear. There are ton of folks on Rasta beach and some are advanced riders with neat gear. Find Larry there, he foils with tiny core kites and wears flame orange jacket, he will know some more folks.

Have fun!

live2play
Medium Poster
Posts: 91
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2012 8:44 pm
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 4 times

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby live2play » Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:56 am

SparD wrote:
Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:15 am
A few close up pics of the new race machine
Have you had much time on the new race foil yet?

wheat
Rare Poster
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:40 am
Kiting since: 2004
Local Beach: Clinton Lake, Lawrence, Kansas
Style: Foil
Gear: 5.5m Cloud, 8m SST, 12m Gong Strutless, 633 Moses, 91cm Mast
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 21 times
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby wheat » Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:40 pm

Grigorib, Thanks for all of your insights into gear. I appreciate all that you test.
I agree that Jan 24th was light in LV. I went to a 12m strutless Gong with Moses 633 wing that day and got some good rides.
I didn't check in with the forums while traveling, so am just now catching up.

I bet we passed each other that day. Link is 26 mile, 2 hour Garmin track from baja joes to rasta that day
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/activity/4478592510
Fun to share some tacks.

I second that Larry from NY is great out of Rasta beach. He is a great Core spokesperson. I wish I found a day to test the gear.

grigorib
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2228
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Kiting since: 2009
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; La Ventana, SPI; Tawas, MI
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, SST 5m, Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m

Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Radical6 138, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/82/91/105cm masts with 590/330 695/425 683s/450 679/483 wingsets, Tim's 36" woody, Slingshot Dwarfcraft Micro 3'6" 2019-2020, MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530

Moses 590/647/330 $740, Moses 633/749/483 $790, Moses 683s/749/483 $890, 75cm alu mast $200, 80cm alu mast $260
.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 146 times
Been thanked: 193 times

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby grigorib » Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:45 pm

wheat wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:40 pm
Grigorib, Thanks for all of your insights into gear. I appreciate all that you test.
I agree that Jan 24th was light in LV. I went to a 12m strutless Gong with Moses 633 wing that day and got some good rides.
I didn't check in with the forums while traveling, so am just now catching up.

I bet we passed each other that day. Link is 26 mile, 2 hour Garmin track from baja joes to rasta that day
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/activity/4478592510
Fun to share some tacks.

I second that Larry from NY is great out of Rasta beach. He is a great Core spokesperson. I wish I found a day to test the gear.
Red kite? I think I saw Robbie on 10m as well

wheat
Rare Poster
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:40 am
Kiting since: 2004
Local Beach: Clinton Lake, Lawrence, Kansas
Style: Foil
Gear: 5.5m Cloud, 8m SST, 12m Gong Strutless, 633 Moses, 91cm Mast
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 21 times
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Moses 2019-2020

Postby wheat » Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:35 pm

Grigorib, Yes, my 12m Gong is all red.
I haven't met Robbie, yet. I think I was watching him attempt some around-the-worlds and was in complete awe.


Return to “Hydrofoil”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: SENDIT!, SolarSet and 6 guests