Contact   Imprint   Advertising   Guidelines

Moses T38 vs T22

A forum dedicated to Hydrofoil riders
Foil
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 873
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:44 pm
Kiting since: 2001
Local Beach: New brighton beach-Derby pool end,Wallasey, near Liverpool
Favorite Beaches: holidays - Flag beach fuerteventura
Home - New Brighton,Rhosneigr, Ainsdale, Fleetwood, Newbrough
Style: improving foiler.
Gear: Groove Skate 130, naked carbon,gold stripes
Moses T38 black, 2020 edition
Indiana foil 120cm
101cm amd 82cm Moses Carbon masts
Moses- 633
Ozone V2 Hyperlink 7mtr
Ozone Chrono V3 UL foil kites - 9/11/13
Ozone Hyperlink V1 ultra light 5mtr
Ozone compact V4 bars,click in, 15-23 mtr lines
massive grin
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 53 times
Been thanked: 102 times

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby Foil » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:38 am

I bet your #68 board is similar to my #56 in appearance and weight,
My #3 board weighs a silly light 2.26 kg,no straps, and quite thin rails away from the rear,
My #. 56 board weighs in without straps at 2.65 kg, and has much thicker rails,
My go to board at the moment is my thinner board as it feels "easier" to body drag out in challenging sea conditions with onshore big wind and waves,
Both feel the same on the water. Both make me smile when sitting on the beach ready to get wet😎
Image

User avatar
Jimmy Mazzanti
Medium Poster
Posts: 113
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 8:31 am
Kiting since: 2000
Style: freeride wave
Gear: mine
Brand Affiliation: Moses
Location: Cesenatico Italy
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 6 times

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby Jimmy Mazzanti » Tue Nov 13, 2018 4:27 pm

francis luengo wrote:
Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:39 pm
Tom Tom wrote:
Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:02 am
Thanks for excellent input. Taking into consideration I am just getting started and still have to master flying gibes, I believe the T38/633 will be a good complement to the T40/550 that I ride today.

Only thing I am pondering at the moment is rocker of the T38. Heard tons of good stuff (specifically concerning rocker) about the Groove Skateboard. The T38 (actually custom by Newind) is a veriy different animal, that also seems to work really well :-/

So now just to decide T38 or Skate?....
Skate is the perfect board for 633 ...sure.
Yes and the T38 is the perfect board for ? :thumb:

francis luengo
Medium Poster
Posts: 60
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2015 12:21 pm
Kiting since: 2004
Gear: moses , cabrinha , ozone.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 0

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby francis luengo » Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:26 pm

Jimmy Mazzanti wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 4:27 pm
francis luengo wrote:
Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:39 pm
Tom Tom wrote:
Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:02 am
Thanks for excellent input. Taking into consideration I am just getting started and still have to master flying gibes, I believe the T38/633 will be a good complement to the T40/550 that I ride today.

Only thing I am pondering at the moment is rocker of the T38. Heard tons of good stuff (specifically concerning rocker) about the Groove Skateboard. The T38 (actually custom by Newind) is a veriy different animal, that also seems to work really well :-/

So now just to decide T38 or Skate?....
Skate is the perfect board for 633 ...sure.
Yes and the T38 is the perfect board for ? :thumb:
Freeride and fun with the 590 wing . :wink:
I prefer skate for carving and little waves with onda.
I would like to try the T22 with onda.
I have both wings and try them in 130 cm board and 120 cm board and prefer small boards for onda.

:thumb:

Tom Tom
Medium Poster
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:45 pm
Kiting since: 0
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 7 times

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby Tom Tom » Wed Nov 14, 2018 11:36 am

Foil wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:38 am
I bet your #68 board is similar to my #56 in appearance and weight,
My #3 board weighs a silly light 2.26 kg,no straps, and quite thin rails away from the rear,
My #. 56 board weighs in without straps at 2.65 kg, and has much thicker rails,
My go to board at the moment is my thinner board as it feels "easier" to body drag out in challenging sea conditions with onshore big wind and waves,
Both feel the same on the water. Both make me smile when sitting on the beach ready to get wet😎
Yes, confirmed. Thicker rails and about 2,5kg.

Tom Tom
Medium Poster
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:45 pm
Kiting since: 0
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 7 times

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby Tom Tom » Wed Nov 14, 2018 11:40 am

francis luengo wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:26 pm
Jimmy Mazzanti wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 4:27 pm
francis luengo wrote:
Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:39 pm

Skate is the perfect board for 633 ...sure.
Yes and the T38 is the perfect board for ? :thumb:
Freeride and fun with the 590 wing . :wink:
I prefer skate for carving and little waves with onda.
I would like to try the T22 with onda.
I have both wings and try them in 130 cm board and 120 cm board and prefer small boards for onda.

:thumb:
Well, went with the T38 on the basis of still learning really and need to touch down more than never. Thinking that the trend will be even shorter boards so I will likely add a 85-95 ultra-pocket when I am more confident. Plus it is gorgeous. Plus I have a Moses dealer nearby. Plus, when looking at the feedback on the Skate and communicating with Groove on a possible order perhaps Moses feels like a more sure-bet if there are issues or problems with it. Having said that, the new Carbon Skate looks really really nice.

JayTC
Rare Poster
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:02 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Currently Brazil Parajuru
Favorite Beaches: Tarifa - Spain
Prea - Brazil
Sakalava Bay - Madagascar
Style: Strapless
Gear: Duotone Pro Whip
Dutotone Neo 6 & 8m2 2020
North Evo 2012 2017
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 0

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby JayTC » Sat Nov 30, 2019 12:11 pm

Hello everyone,
Super interesting experts discussion :idea:

If I may jump onboard with a question of mine, I just freshly started foil and got hooked :roll:

I will rent the school foil for one week and the would like to buy something that will last me in the progression curve, if that's possible. :roll:

I was wondering if a T38 with the onda 633 would be ok to learn and improve? Or it's too radical and difficult; hence will disgust me of life :allbegood:
It would mean going with the T38 after just one week of foil

edit : Forgot to mention that I have a decently good level in strapless if that helps

Would be awesome to hear from your T38 experience :D

bigwave
Frequent Poster
Posts: 499
Joined: Tue May 28, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 2000
Style: Foil and Surf.
Gear: Kites: Airush, Flysurfer
Boards: DSD Intel,Moses
Harnesses: Mystic
Wetsuits: Mystic
Brand Affiliation: www.silentsports.com
Location: www.silentsports.com
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 4 times

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby bigwave » Sat Nov 30, 2019 2:31 pm

JayTC wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 12:11 pm
Hello everyone,
Super interesting experts discussion :idea:

If I may jump onboard with a question of mine, I just freshly started foil and got hooked :roll:

I will rent the school foil for one week and the would like to buy something that will last me in the progression curve, if that's possible. :roll:

I was wondering if a T38 with the onda 633 would be ok to learn and improve? Or it's too radical and difficult; hence will disgust me of life :allbegood:
It would mean going with the T38 after just one week of foil

edit : Forgot to mention that I have a decently good level in strapless if that helps

Would be awesome to hear from your T38 experience :D
We have had several customers buy a Moses Onda 633 and T38 as their first foil. We lend them a Slingshot Simulator 5'6" board for a couple sessions. Everyone one has had a positive with this scenario and they are usually riding the T38 in about 3-6 hours.
A couple factor to consider. One, if you are a heavier person , this could be an issue. The T38 is still a small board. Two, turning the board initially will be more difficult. While it is fairly user friendly on touch downs , it requires reasonable footwork right away to assist in on the water turning.
I would go for it. You know your abilities. After a week of learning you should be ready for the T38.
These users thanked the author bigwave for the post:
JayTC (Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:12 pm)
Rating: 10%

JayTC
Rare Poster
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:02 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Currently Brazil Parajuru
Favorite Beaches: Tarifa - Spain
Prea - Brazil
Sakalava Bay - Madagascar
Style: Strapless
Gear: Duotone Pro Whip
Dutotone Neo 6 & 8m2 2020
North Evo 2012 2017
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 0

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby JayTC » Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:16 pm

bigwave wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 2:31 pm
JayTC wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 12:11 pm
Hello everyone,
Super interesting experts discussion :idea:

If I may jump onboard with a question of mine, I just freshly started foil and got hooked :roll:

I will rent the school foil for one week and the would like to buy something that will last me in the progression curve, if that's possible. :roll:

I was wondering if a T38 with the onda 633 would be ok to learn and improve? Or it's too radical and difficult; hence will disgust me of life :allbegood:
It would mean going with the T38 after just one week of foil

edit : Forgot to mention that I have a decently good level in strapless if that helps

Would be awesome to hear from your T38 experience :D
We have had several customers buy a Moses Onda 633 and T38 as their first foil. We lend them a Slingshot Simulator 5'6" board for a couple sessions. Everyone one has had a positive with this scenario and they are usually riding the T38 in about 3-6 hours.
A couple factor to consider. One, if you are a heavier person , this could be an issue. The T38 is still a small board. Two, turning the board initially will be more difficult. While it is fairly user friendly on touch downs , it requires reasonable footwork right away to assist in on the water turning.
I would go for it. You know your abilities. After a week of learning you should be ready for the T38.
Hi BigWave,

Thanks a lot for your super fast answer and explanation.
That sounds awesome! I guess I am a medium rider as I am 80kg / 176 lbs

I am also wondering, would I be better off starting with the 71 vs 91cm mast to start? In the coming month I would be in rather flat places (Brazil :D ) but later on I guess I would anyway invest also on the 91cm to have easier time in more choppy condition (if I understood it correctly from the different posts).

And also since you are experienced on them, is it worth to invest in the T38 ltd with the track system, or the red one is just enough

Again, thank you so much for your awesome input!

bigwave
Frequent Poster
Posts: 499
Joined: Tue May 28, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 2000
Style: Foil and Surf.
Gear: Kites: Airush, Flysurfer
Boards: DSD Intel,Moses
Harnesses: Mystic
Wetsuits: Mystic
Brand Affiliation: www.silentsports.com
Location: www.silentsports.com
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 4 times

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby bigwave » Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:35 pm

Hi BigWave,

Thanks a lot for your super fast answer and explanation.
That sounds awesome! I guess I am a medium rider as I am 80kg / 176 lbs

I am also wondering, would I be better off starting with the 71 vs 91cm mast to start? In the coming month I would be in rather flat places (Brazil :D ) but later on I guess I would anyway invest also on the 91cm to have easier time in more choppy condition (if I understood it correctly from the different posts).

And also since you are experienced on them, is it worth to invest in the T38 ltd with the track system, or the red one is just enough

Again, thank you so much for your awesome input!
[/quote]

You are very welcome! The trend in the industry is moving toward shorter masts. I have ridden everything from 60-100cm. Currently ,I use a 71cm Moses. IMO , 80cm is the perfect size(this depends of course on what/where your riding). The longer mast offers advantages, mainly you can go faster(more margin for error) and you can go up wind higher(better angle of attack). For recreational free riding , 60-80 works great.Moses is coming out with an 82cm mast this year which will be awesome!
The RED Moses has been discontinued for the 2020 model year. It will be "replaced" by the T38 Black(with tracks) at the RED price point. The new Moses T38 LTD will be made by Appletree . The current RED T38 offers very good adjustability with through hull mounting. You can use 6 series wings with the rear setting and 5 series wings on the forward setting. The current Black T38 , is more limited to 6 series wings. The track is place more towards the rear and you can only move the foil about an inch or so in the track. Keep in mind I'm talking about use with straps. Strapless, you will get better adjustment.
Good luck with your foiling and keep us posted on your learning curve!

:thumb:
These users thanked the author bigwave for the post:
JayTC (Sun Dec 01, 2019 10:29 pm)
Rating: 10%

JayTC
Rare Poster
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Nov 30, 2019 3:02 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Currently Brazil Parajuru
Favorite Beaches: Tarifa - Spain
Prea - Brazil
Sakalava Bay - Madagascar
Style: Strapless
Gear: Duotone Pro Whip
Dutotone Neo 6 & 8m2 2020
North Evo 2012 2017
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 0

Re: Moses T38 vs T22

Postby JayTC » Sun Dec 01, 2019 10:29 pm

bigwave wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 2:35 pm
Hi BigWave,

Thanks a lot for your super fast answer and explanation.
That sounds awesome! I guess I am a medium rider as I am 80kg / 176 lbs

I am also wondering, would I be better off starting with the 71 vs 91cm mast to start? In the coming month I would be in rather flat places (Brazil :D ) but later on I guess I would anyway invest also on the 91cm to have easier time in more choppy condition (if I understood it correctly from the different posts).

And also since you are experienced on them, is it worth to invest in the T38 ltd with the track system, or the red one is just enough

Again, thank you so much for your awesome input!
You are very welcome! The trend in the industry is moving toward shorter masts. I have ridden everything from 60-100cm. Currently ,I use a 71cm Moses. IMO , 80cm is the perfect size(this depends of course on what/where your riding). The longer mast offers advantages, mainly you can go faster(more margin for error) and you can go up wind higher(better angle of attack). For recreational free riding , 60-80 works great.Moses is coming out with an 82cm mast this year which will be awesome!
The RED Moses has been discontinued for the 2020 model year. It will be "replaced" by the T38 Black(with tracks) at the RED price point. The new Moses T38 LTD will be made by Appletree . The current RED T38 offers very good adjustability with through hull mounting. You can use 6 series wings with the rear setting and 5 series wings on the forward setting. The current Black T38 , is more limited to 6 series wings. The track is place more towards the rear and you can only move the foil about an inch or so in the track. Keep in mind I'm talking about use with straps. Strapless, you will get better adjustment.
Good luck with your foiling and keep us posted on your learning curve!

:thumb:
[/quote]

Thank you so much! Really appreciate you have taken the time to explain me all this.
I am super stoked! Had my third day on a 5'6" F-One and could finally ride away to the sunset.

Plus looking at the light wind forecast of the coming 8 days, it's a matter of sanity to invest in a foil :P

I'll keep you guys updated on my learning curve and how it was for me to start on that one.

Thanks a lot for the helping spirit :thumb:


Return to “Hydrofoil”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests