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Does board volume still matter for water starts?

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stevez
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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby stevez » Fri Dec 21, 2018 11:22 pm

I think for conventional kite wings, you need a bit of planing ability. I have a couple boards of 97cm and 99cm and they are big enough. I'm not trying to capture the sub 10 knot sessions though. For lighter winds, a bit bigger would help, as would some volume.
If you're riding a surf wing I really don't think it matters. You need enough board to stand on. You don't need to be able to plane them at all. They just pop straight on to the foil with the slightest bit of forward momentum, and you can pump them a little to stay up while you reload the kite. I'm planning on validating this theory at some point by building a board in the 80 to 85cm range.

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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby joriws » Sat Dec 22, 2018 4:29 pm

SENDIT! wrote:
Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:18 am
I think that if you are heavy, like I am, a no volume board is very difficult to get up and going. While I was in the Bahamas this year at the Cabrinha dealer meeting, I had a chance to first try the Double Agent, then the X-Breed Foil board. The winds were pretty light (I was on a 17 Contra in about 10-12 mph) and I couldn't even ever get up and going on the Double Agent. It just didn't have the volume necessary to support me after the initial dive/upstroke where I was struggling to get going.
I am heavy too and I can go in lighter winds on door twintip which does not have much volume. It is all about acceleration by kite to speed and board area to displace water when moving. Not the volume.

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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby TomW » Sat Dec 22, 2018 5:08 pm

stevez wrote:
Fri Dec 21, 2018 11:22 pm
I think for conventional kite wings, you need a bit of planing ability. I have a couple boards of 97cm and 99cm and they are big enough. I'm not trying to capture the sub 10 knot sessions though. For lighter winds, a bit bigger would help, as would some volume.
If you're riding a surf wing I really don't think it matters. You need enough board to stand on. You don't need to be able to plane them at all. They just pop straight on to the foil with the slightest bit of forward momentum, and you can pump them a little to stay up while you reload the kite. I'm planning on validating this theory at some point by building a board in the 80 to 85cm range.
Glassing a 90cm x 46cm now. It's pretty thick tho, 3cm at the tail. Want it to float a bit. My 120cm floats on its side with the 633 wing. Which is somewhat of a problem sometimes.

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SENDIT!
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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby SENDIT! » Sat Dec 22, 2018 9:14 pm

joriws wrote:
Sat Dec 22, 2018 4:29 pm
SENDIT! wrote:
Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:18 am
I think that if you are heavy, like I am, a no volume board is very difficult to get up and going. While I was in the Bahamas this year at the Cabrinha dealer meeting, I had a chance to first try the Double Agent, then the X-Breed Foil board. The winds were pretty light (I was on a 17 Contra in about 10-12 mph) and I couldn't even ever get up and going on the Double Agent. It just didn't have the volume necessary to support me after the initial dive/upstroke where I was struggling to get going.
I am heavy too and I can go in lighter winds on door twintip which does not have much volume. It is all about acceleration by kite to speed and board area to displace water when moving. Not the volume.
You know, that's the exact argument that I make for why I can ride a Litewave WIng in less wind than I can a surfboard, so now you're making me wonder. Hmm... :wink:

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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby edt » Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:18 pm

Good question! I don't know the answer just reading the responses here from the experts. Was the entire idea of having more volume a hold over from the years when we had those giant 100cm racing boards and you always went faster with more volume? For a hydrofoil once the board is out of the water, what is the point of all the volume?

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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby matanshapira » Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:57 pm

With my LF Impulse I wasn't really successful with waterstart to surface level fjrst, it always takes off right away for me at 72kg, it is quite hard to NOT fly from the begining becauss it requires a lot of front foot pressure which makes the nose dive, sweet spot is too narrow for non flying water start.

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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby jumptheshark » Sun Dec 23, 2018 5:33 am

9 knots and up, surface area is more important than volume. Width is more influential than length for getting up. Length is more influential than width for swing weight and agility.

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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby kitexpert » Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:31 pm

joriws wrote: It is all about acceleration by kite to speed and board area to displace water when moving. Not the volume.
Not all about. Volume can help water starts. With hf's most people don't want to use big kites so when diving the kite there is not that much power. If board has no volume it sinks (esp. with heavy aluminium foil), if it has quite a lot volume it gives you time to get it in control and then go up on a wing. Of course when you learn hf you can rise up almost immediately but for learning stage IMO board with volume is better. When decently powered water start is not a problem with either.

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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby tomtom » Sun Dec 23, 2018 8:33 pm

I vote for no volume - either for learning and for riding - I see no benefit from volume board WITH big surfing wing.

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Re: Does board volume still matter for water starts?

Postby K-Roy » Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:42 pm

IMO.
low wind and/or low skill level= more volume board
high (sufficient) wind and/or higher skill level= less volume board
with the introduction of larger foil wings the above "rules" are not clear cut, but generally this is what I go by...

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