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Foils that don't sink. How much of a problem is it

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NYKiter
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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby NYKiter » Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:15 am

WOW thats forward foot placement on a dwarf....never rode that far forward on the Onda....wonder how much lift that has compared to the 633....

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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby Qiter » Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:48 am

A foil floating on its side might also be a good thing in some situations:
- Much easier to spot when there is a bit of chop and the sun is at a bad angle, especially when strapless. I know several cases of "lost foils" in such situations, especially in beginners.
- Does not hit the ground so fast in areas where its shallow (of course you usually do not foil there but you might well drift into such areas when wind drops..)

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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby Regis-de-giens » Wed Feb 20, 2019 3:09 pm

Right ...
And a sinking foil could surf one big waves and go downwind very fast and far away. It happened to me and in fact it was ... the same floating foil that had not sink this time ... bad chance ...

So ... no perfect behaviour, i think it should not drive your foil choice.

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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby Peter_Frank » Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:53 pm

Qiter wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:48 am
A foil floating on its side might also be a good thing in some situations:
- Much easier to spot when there is a bit of chop and the sun is at a bad angle, especially when strapless. I know several cases of "lost foils" in such situations, especially in beginners.
- Does not hit the ground so fast in areas where its shallow (of course you usually do not foil there but you might well drift into such areas when wind drops..)

Very true indeed, MUCH easier to spot, and it does not dolphin away from you.

Also, it does not get washed ashore in the break, like it would immediately otherwise, and get pounded on the bottom.

I am often VERY annoyed when I have to bodydrag to a board on its side right now, as the water is only 2 degrees celcius (and I dont use a hood, and sometimes not gloves either), so a PITA :o

Apart from that, which is mostly this time of the year its a bugger, only good things when they dont sink.

But thi

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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby TomW » Wed Feb 20, 2019 6:07 pm

Agree with PF. At first I thought foil floating on its side was good. Now I'm not too happy about it.

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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby OzBungy » Thu Feb 21, 2019 9:24 am

I had a minor inconvenience today when I stalled my kite and fell off my board. The board was barely 2m away. I tried to swim after it but it took off. There was no way I was going to catch it swimming as fast as I possibly could. I tried to chase it down, just to see if I could. I gave up and relaunched my kite and quickly caught up to the board.

9 times out of 10 the foil sinking is great. If the board is upwind it turns and moves downwind back to you.

For those times when the board is away from you and your kite is crashed it can be a total disaster.

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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby DAnderson » Thu Feb 21, 2019 7:21 pm

NYKiter wrote:
Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:15 am
WOW thats forward foot placement on a dwarf....never rode that far forward on the Onda....wonder how much lift that has compared to the 633....
That wing is ~1600+ sq cm, vs ~1200 sq cm on the 633. Very noticeable increase when riding.
I demo'd it bolted onto a cabrinha board & had a heck of a time recovering it occasionally.

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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby Peter_Frank » Thu Feb 21, 2019 7:56 pm

In all honesty, the problem is:

If it sinks, it will tackle downwind maybe into the lines and kite WAY too fast if you ever get the kite in the water, and often get hammered into the shore/bottom also.

If it floats, it can take longer to retrieve, but usually possible only in marginal winds you might not be able to.
But pulling yourself ashore and waiting for it, is always an option :D

Strapless waterstarts are blistering fast when it floats, so of several downsides, I would prefer one that floats, not in doubt - even if I occasionally swear a bit over it too :naughty:

8) PF
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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby BWD » Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:35 pm

This thread, to me, is like complaining your porsche 911 has less stability control than your mercedes s class.
Yes, too much speed/power/too light/too agile can be challenging. On the one hand that's the fun of it.
On the other hand, this problem can be solved with aluminum gear (also cheaper).
It all works.
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Regis-de-giens
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Re: Foils that don’t sink. How much of a problem is it

Postby Regis-de-giens » Fri Feb 22, 2019 8:38 am

Peter_Frank wrote:
Thu Feb 21, 2019 7:56 pm
In all honesty, the problem is:

If it sinks, it will tackle downwind maybe into the lines and kite WAY too fast if you ever get the kite in the water, and often get hammered into the shore/bottom also.

If it floats, it can take longer to retrieve, but usually possible only in marginal winds you might not be able to.
But pulling yourself ashore and waiting for it, is always an option :D

Strapless waterstarts are blistering fast when it floats, so of several downsides, I would prefer one that floats, not in doubt - even if I occasionally swear a bit over it too :naughty:

8) PF
Yes I agree ; just one light comment : in very light, I think it is really easy to actively swimm upwind (with your legs and 1 or 2 arms, kite up); the worse situation I experienced is quite strong wind with waves and a very low AR kites like Flysurfer Viron , where the kite pulls too hard downwind to swimm upwind to the foil, while big waves can put it rapidly out of your view. Otherwise indeed, it is not a tricky situation to have a floating HF


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