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Small Foil kites (ram air...not SLE) in High Winds Foiling

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NYKiter
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Small Foil kites (ram air...not SLE) in High Winds Foiling

Postby NYKiter » Fri May 10, 2019 1:06 pm

Finding a 3.5 mono SLE backstalls pretty bad during water starts in lower 30s wind while foiling....riding is fine...

If you use a foil kite (ram air...not SLE) for high winds what size?
what kind of range do you have on it - especially on a Moses?
Last edited by NYKiter on Fri May 10, 2019 1:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Small Foil kites in High Winds Foiling

Postby junebug » Fri May 10, 2019 1:23 pm

I have no experience with a Mono, so I can’t speak directly to your issue. I have ridden my 4m SST in as low as 16kn. It backstalls at that wind speed if I choke it even the smallest bit. You might want to try pulling in a little trim and / or focus on not pulling in on the bar when you waterstart? It doesn’t seem like a properly trimmed 3.5m should stall at the wind speeds you are talking about.

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Re: Small Foil kites in High Winds Foiling

Postby alowishus » Fri May 10, 2019 1:39 pm

junebug wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 1:23 pm
I have no experience with a Mono, so I can’t speak directly to your issue. I have ridden my 4m SST in as low as 16kn. It backstalls at that wind speed if I choke it even the smallest bit. You might want to try pulling in a little trim and / or focus on not pulling in on the bar when you waterstart? It doesn’t seem like a properly trimmed 3.5m should stall at the wind speeds you are talking about.
Can you please advise which foil you were on? I’ve flown my 4m SST at higher winds a couple of times. I found it a bit challenging tbh at first but improved on the second session. The speed of the small kite seems to require some new skills I am lacking.

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Re: Small Foil kites in High Winds Foiling

Postby NYKiter » Fri May 10, 2019 1:49 pm

I think its more of a kite size issue.... Im finding the Neo 5m can back stall a little under heavy load during water start in upper 20s winds....
certainly the 3.5 I have to lean almost on top of the foil to sheet out enough to get a bite for take off.....

The power zone is so tiny and the kite is so fast its much more difficult to peg the exact spot for take off....sheeting out makes the power zone bigger but its a pain in the ass...
wondering if small foil kites (ram air not SLE) might be better for high winds...

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Re: Small Foil kites (ram air...not SLE) in High Winds Foiling

Postby jakemoore » Fri May 10, 2019 2:18 pm

I have definitely had hit or miss results with small tube kites and small foil kites. I'm not super excited about launching and landing closed cell foil kites in strong winds. In addition, foil kites have a stronger power spike when they go through the window and less immediate and complete depower which becomes more challenging as the windspeed increases. Small kites are also more sensitive to uneven line lengths and also changes is the mixer and bridle. So I would definitely not generalize that foil kites are better for these conditions.

That said, I have really enjoyed:

Speed 4 DLX 8m (the old 3 gallery bridle speed 4) on a surfboard in 25 knots plus. It has unusually immediate depower and out of this world drift downwind. It may be a bit much for foiling in high winds. Unfortunately 8 was the smallest size

Hyperlink 5 is working well for me 15-25 knots. Probably could extend the top end range with shorter lines.

Peak 4 3m is superb in 18 knots plus. No fear of a spanking on launch or land. Its a joy to fly. I have not found the top end. Don't drop it.

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Re: Small Foil kites (ram air...not SLE) in High Winds Foiling

Postby drsurf » Fri May 10, 2019 3:29 pm

+1 for the Peak4 3m.
Try one and see what you think. Not expensive, easy to fly and keep flying even if you're foiling downwind at the kite!

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Re: Small Foil kites (ram air...not SLE) in High Winds Foiling

Postby tomtom » Fri May 10, 2019 4:14 pm

1+ Peak4 3m

but back stalling on smaller kites are probably simply geometric function of small sizes /same stroke on bar have much more impact to kite AOA/ . So Peak isnt immune to back stall.

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Re: Small Foil kites (ram air...not SLE) in High Winds Foiling

Postby Peter_Frank » Fri May 10, 2019 5:28 pm

tomtom wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 4:14 pm
1+ Peak4 3m

but back stalling on smaller kites are probably simply geometric function of small sizes /same stroke on bar have much more impact to kite AOA/ . So Peak isnt immune to back stall.

True, small kites dont backstall "more", it is the rider, if not used to it often, that stalls the kite because of super short sheeting range on the bar.

It is soooo easy to oversheet a really small kite, so one has to adapt to this.
Also remember, if you use a kite on a TT or Waveboard also, the trim has to be changed a lot when you go foiling, somewhat longer rearlines is essential, or pulling the depower a lot.

Only when getting up to 5 or 6 m2 kites, they begin to feel "easy" and more normal in this respect, is my experience.

Small foil kites below 5 m2 has the tendency to be extremely difficult to master as the powerspike is CRAZY powerful - some like it others hate it :D :(

8) PF

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Re: Small Foil kites in High Winds Foiling

Postby junebug » Fri May 10, 2019 5:35 pm

alowishus wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 1:39 pm
junebug wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 1:23 pm
I have no experience with a Mono, so I can’t speak directly to your issue. I have ridden my 4m SST in as low as 16kn. It backstalls at that wind speed if I choke it even the smallest bit. You might want to try pulling in a little trim and / or focus on not pulling in on the bar when you waterstart? It doesn’t seem like a properly trimmed 3.5m should stall at the wind speeds you are talking about.
Can you please advise which foil you were on? I’ve flown my 4m SST at higher winds a couple of times. I found it a bit challenging tbh at first but improved on the second session. The speed of the small kite seems to require some new skills I am lacking.
Lift 150

It definitely took me some practice to get the hang of kites that small. Now, I fly them every opportunity I get.
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