Contact   Imprint   Advertising   Guidelines

Peak Foil

A forum dedicated to Hydrofoil riders
OzBungy
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2203
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2005 11:35 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 32 times

Peak Foil

Postby OzBungy » Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:23 am

I am wondering if we have reached "peak foil" in terms of design. Have foils got as good as they're going to get?

All the leading racers are riding Mike's Lab or Chubanga. It seems the main factor in winning is whether the rider makes a mistake or not. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the manufacturer team riders are using Mike's Lab with their sponsor's stickers.

I have been using my favourite foil for nearly three years. The more I use it the more I like it. I can't see anything new coming out that would let me do anything different to what I do now. My progression is more linked to how I approach things. The gear is not an issue.

Zeeko brought out the Spitfire a while ago. That didn't really spark much of a revolution. Oyvind has the wing connected direct to the mast. No fuselage or stabiliser. That could be interesting to see where that goes.

The SUP and surf foilers are having a bit of a revolution with huge high aspect wings. It won't take long for that to sort itself out.

The wind foilers are still scratching their heads and still thinking that foiling is a scary dangerous, expensive thing that will only work in light wind (just like kiteboarding).

The only area of development that seems to continue is efforts to make aluminium masts that don't corrode too fast, and plate mounts that can be slotted on without an engineering team.

Pemba
Frequent Poster
Posts: 266
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2015 5:39 am
Kiting since: 2003
Local Beach: Murrebue
Gear: Ozone C4, Brokite Hybrid
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 18 times
Been thanked: 7 times

Re: Peak Foil

Postby Pemba » Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:41 am

I'm kind of amazed that you still need a screwdriver (or similar) to connect to the board. A lot of development potential there. Not very important maybe but should be relatively easy.

slowboat
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 516
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:55 pm
Kiting since: 2000
Style: wave foiling
Gear: This and that
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 61 times
Been thanked: 53 times

Re: Peak Foil

Postby slowboat » Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:17 am

How about an e-foil that can power you upwind but is designed so you can properly surf big waves with the power off?

dave1986
Frequent Poster
Posts: 287
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 3:25 am
Kiting since: 2003
Gear: .
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 28 times
Been thanked: 19 times

Re: Peak Foil

Postby dave1986 » Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:21 am

Pemba wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:41 am
I'm kind of amazed that you still need a screwdriver (or similar) to connect to the board. A lot of development potential there. Not very important maybe but should be relatively easy.
This could be a good option. But expensive and I've not seen any reviews yet.
These users thanked the author dave1986 for the post (total 2):
Pemba (Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:22 am) • foilholio (Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:57 pm)
Rating: 20%

foilholio
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2823
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:20 am
Kiting since: 1337
Local Beach: Ventura Beach
Favorite Beaches: Tarifa
Style: Airstyle
Gear: Foils
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 125 times
Been thanked: 56 times

Re: Peak Foil

Postby foilholio » Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:57 pm

looks nice

tomtom
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1155
Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 1:00 am
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 113 times

Re: Peak Foil

Postby tomtom » Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:29 pm

I want lighter setup, Foils are still too heavy - Horue is only brand with weight optimized setup. And also i want tunable float - with water fillable chamber in front wing. Other than that im pretty happy with 633 /2 years/

juandesooka
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1014
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 8:05 pm
Kiting since: 2011
Local Beach: Sooke, BC, Canada
Style: Canada's Kai Lenny (in my mind)
Gear: Ocean Rodeo / Stringy Foil / Slingshot Surf Foil
Brand Affiliation: Open to offers
Has thanked: 34 times
Been thanked: 35 times

Re: Peak Foil

Postby juandesooka » Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:48 pm

slowboat wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:17 am
How about an e-foil that can power you upwind but is designed so you can properly surf big waves with the power off?
I saw an older fellow last year surfing a long board that had a motor on the bottom. He could motor out slowly at maybe 5kts, then he'd paddle into waves, surf them in, and repeat. He had shoulder problems, couldn't paddle for long. And his surfing was more or less standing still riding along, so the added drag of the motor didn't affect surfboard performance that much.

But got me thinking. If I attached that motor to the bottom of my sup foil, I could get into waves without a paddle, or into waves that are not really paddle-able like unbreaking wind swells. The difference is that once I get up on foil, motor is out of the water, there is no drag, surf the wave until it's done, sink back down, motor back out for another.

Cheapest option seemed to be: motor off aliexpress designed for RC boats, attached to foil mast, battery backpack, remote control in hand.

A few weeks later, I see a guy in Maui has done just that ... battery built into the board, jet motor shoots out the tail. So it's being done! I didn't hear any more on it since, though, maybe a failed experiment, or too expensive to catch on. I'll see if I can find the posts, would be interesting to see what happened.

tomtom
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1155
Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 1:00 am
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 113 times

Re: Peak Foil

Postby tomtom » Tue Sep 17, 2019 5:54 pm

That is actually brilliant idea

User avatar
jumptheshark
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 833
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 6:36 pm
Kiting since: 0
Local Beach: Shhhhh
Favorite Beaches: Nude
Gear: The good stuff
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 82 times
Been thanked: 168 times

Re: Peak Foil

Postby jumptheshark » Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:25 pm

I don't think we have reached peak foil. The racers might be getting close, but for everything else we are in the infancy. Well, maybe just beyond that into adolescence.

E foil has a long way to go. They are pretty impressive, with decent power and range, the foils themselves are also pretty good, but the weight of the battery pack is a real damper on any kind of performance surfing. Real top to bottom surfing with a foil in almost the full range of wave shape and size is coming. We are no where near the peak because we are no where near peak foil riding. You need the foil to get the rider, but then you get the real refinement. Racing has loads of top competent riders. Surfing, not so much. There are a few real standouts, but not enough. Once the average advanced foil surfer can do the stuff Kai is doing now, then we will see faster and faster evolution in the actual foils and they will settle on designs for any given type of foiling.

juandesooka
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1014
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2012 8:05 pm
Kiting since: 2011
Local Beach: Sooke, BC, Canada
Style: Canada's Kai Lenny (in my mind)
Gear: Ocean Rodeo / Stringy Foil / Slingshot Surf Foil
Brand Affiliation: Open to offers
Has thanked: 34 times
Been thanked: 35 times

Re: Peak Foil

Postby juandesooka » Tue Sep 17, 2019 8:38 pm

jumptheshark wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:25 pm
I don't think we have reached peak foil. The racers might be getting close, but for everything else we are in the infancy. Well, maybe just beyond that into adolescence.

E foil has a long way to go. They are pretty impressive, with decent power and range, the foils themselves are also pretty good, but the weight of the battery pack is a real damper on any kind of performance surfing. Real top to bottom surfing with a foil in almost the full range of wave shape and size is coming. We are no where near the peak because we are no where near peak foil riding. You need the foil to get the rider, but then you get the real refinement. Racing has loads of top competent riders. Surfing, not so much. There are a few real standouts, but not enough. Once the average advanced foil surfer can do the stuff Kai is doing now, then we will see faster and faster evolution in the actual foils and they will settle on designs for any given type of foiling.
I agree with this ... as more talented riders take it up, the envelope gets pushed on possibilities, the gear gets further refinement and then pushes it even further. In surf foiling, things are changing pretty quickly. 2 years ago Kai Lenny blew minds getting multiple waves pumping back out, now the videos show riders doing back flips off the wave while pumping back out. Or doing beach starts on tiny boards, pumping into multiple km swell downwinders with dry hair. Both examples require different gear.

Similarly, the wing foil progression has been pretty rapid, from lame slow lawn mowing to airs and wave riding. The big difference being quality of riders taking it up ... once KL and Keahi de Aboitz got on it, a next level of capabilities open up, especially in the surfing side of things.

efoil...personally I have zero interest in the flat water zipping around. Reminds me of the motorized surfboard back in the 1980s, with the 2 stroke motor. ;-) But I like the idea of using efoil technology if it gets me more waves and longer rides, as long as the ride isn't negatively affected by the tech. Here's a link to the sup foil diy I mentioned above: The video looks really slow ... and the lack of follow up since makes me think it may not have worked as hoped for. It will take a lot of failed prototypes before the next big thing actually works.

That's the cool thing about innovation, you can't possibly imagine what's coming, then when the sea change happens, your world is rocked. I remember back in the early 80s saying "skateboarding has gone as far as it can", then somebody perfected the ollie and now it is beyond belief what skateboarders are doing now. Same with airs in surfing or strapless airs in kiting.


Return to “Hydrofoil”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Tony and 5 guests

cron