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Wingfoil mast lenght

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kitenight11
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Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby kitenight11 » Sat Sep 28, 2019 6:27 pm

Hi,
I am struggeling a bit with my flights while winging. I have a 80cm mast with 2200cm frontwing. I need more than 15 knts on my 130 ltr. Board to get enough speed to start coming up. Pumping is difficult for me. Wwould it be easier to pump on ashorter mast? Kitefoiling on a 90cm mast is no problem for me.
Any tips are welcome.

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Re: Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby bigtone667 » Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:58 pm

I am surprised you need 15 knots.

I am riding an AXIS 102 (2000cm2) on 65cm mast with a Naish 125litre board and I am getting lift from about 6 or 7 knots. My max speed on the foil is only about 10 or 11 knots on flat water.

If i have 20 to 25 knots, I do not even need to pump.

Does your board have a lot of rocker?

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Re: Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby Peter_Frank » Sun Sep 29, 2019 9:40 pm

bigtone667 wrote:
Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:58 pm
I am surprised you need 15 knots.

I am riding an AXIS 102 (2000cm2) on 65cm mast with a Naish 125litre board and I am getting lift from about 6 or 7 knots. My max speed on the foil is only about 10 or 11 knots on flat water.

If i have 20 to 25 knots, I do not even need to pump.

Does your board have a lot of rocker?
Amazed you can wingfoil in less wind than most kitefoils, I don't really understand that, even with the bigger wing.

8) PF

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Re: Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby bigtone667 » Mon Sep 30, 2019 1:21 am

Peter_Frank wrote:
Sun Sep 29, 2019 9:40 pm
bigtone667 wrote:
Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:58 pm
I am surprised you need 15 knots.

I am riding an AXIS 102 (2000cm2) on 65cm mast with a Naish 125litre board and I am getting lift from about 6 or 7 knots. My max speed on the foil is only about 10 or 11 knots on flat water.

If i have 20 to 25 knots, I do not even need to pump.

Does your board have a lot of rocker?
Amazed you can wingfoil in less wind than most kitefoils, I don't really understand that, even with the bigger wing.

8) PF
I definitely kitefoil in 7/8 knots without any issues. Got no chance of doing that on a wing. But these riding these wings is so much fun. :D

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Re: Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby juandesooka » Mon Sep 30, 2019 3:31 am

My gong 5m needs 15kt minimum. The 7m is reported to work down to 10kt.

I started on 24 inch mast and moved to 30 inch to help with breaches.

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Re: Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Sep 30, 2019 7:31 am

bigtone667 wrote:
Mon Sep 30, 2019 1:21 am
Peter_Frank wrote:
Sun Sep 29, 2019 9:40 pm
bigtone667 wrote:
Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:58 pm
I am surprised you need 15 knots.

I am riding an AXIS 102 (2000cm2) on 65cm mast with a Naish 125litre board and I am getting lift from about 6 or 7 knots. My max speed on the foil is only about 10 or 11 knots on flat water.

If i have 20 to 25 knots, I do not even need to pump.

Does your board have a lot of rocker?

Amazed you can wingfoil in less wind than most kitefoils, I don't really understand that, even with the bigger wing.

8) PF

I definitely kitefoil in 7/8 knots without any issues. Got no chance of doing that on a wing. But these riding these wings is so much fun. :D

Now I dont understand anything in this wingfoil thread...

I assume you write you can wingfoil from about 6 or 7 knots right?

That what I found amazing, almost not to believe :roll:

But now you write about kitefoiling in 7-8 knots (which is easy yes)

8) PF

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Re: Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby kitenight11 » Mon Sep 30, 2019 8:16 am

Hi,
could yyou please tell the differences in pumping and the mast lenght? Btw, my weight is 90 kg and wingsize is 4,2m. Maybe that is the reason I need at least 15-20 ktns?

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Re: Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby gmb13 » Mon Sep 30, 2019 9:10 am

kitenight11 wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 6:27 pm
Hi,
I am struggeling a bit with my flights while winging. I have a 80cm mast with 2200cm frontwing. I need more than 15 knts on my 130 ltr. Board to get enough speed to start coming up. Pumping is difficult for me. Wwould it be easier to pump on ashorter mast? Kitefoiling on a 90cm mast is no problem for me.
Any tips are welcome.
Hi Guys,

To make it simple. Yes a shorter Mast is easier to pump up into flight as there is more drag on a longer mast. However, once flying the shorter mast will give you less height to glide on.

Now to another thing that not very many people understand. Surface Area is not a good indication of the actual lifting potential of a front wing. Actually it is almost useless. For example the Moses 873 has almost the same area as the AXIS 1020, but as the profile is thinner and the profile taper is much thinner towards the tips, the 873 needs more speed/power to fly. Volume and Span are way more important in my experience. So when you talk about your foil, please tell us which foil you are actually using.

Also not all Wings are the same. There is a huge difference in low end between the different brands. Would be helpful to know which Wing you are on.

Thanks,

--
Gunnar
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Slyde
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Re: Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby Slyde » Mon Sep 30, 2019 11:40 am

Agree with Gunnar but even so it seems something is not right about what you are doing. You should be able to foil easily with that gear in 15 knots. I am only a beginner but can foil with a 4.2 at approx 12 knots with a 2000 cm2 wing and much the same with a 1600 cm2 wing, maybe a knot or 2 more required. To be honest I suspect I am overcalling the wind and only 10 knots is required with a little pumping. I have been surprised at the low end of these things. Try moving the mast all the way forward, keep you weight a bit more forward so the tail doesnt sink. Start on you natural foot tack so you can pump better. Dont try to point too high, keep the wing a little more vertical ie. front hand higher to generate some lift as well as forward drive. If you can kitefoil you should find the basics very simple to master. I'm guessing it will click very soon.

Peter Frank you will be surprised at the low end of these things even with the current gear. Im guessing by next year all the companies will have wings which can be pumped onto the foil in less than 10 knots. Its a fun new experience. I had fun on a wing session on saturday in very patchy winds that would have been unkiteable because it was so patchy. Eventually the wind died but I was upwind so could drift back to my start like we used to do on a windsurfer. If I was on a kite it would have been a big swim. I see this new sport as something that will get you out in some conditions when you cant kite. Patchy stuff, launches where you need to paddle out to a windline etc, sketchy beaches where you cant launch a kite..... The surf side is just being explored now. On sunday I had a magic kitefoiling session in flat water and 8-12 knot winds on a racefoil. It will be hard to match that buzz in flat water on a wing so at the moment kitefoiling is still king for me.....but lets see what I am saying in a year. Exciting times. I have a few predictions on what will happen but thats for another discussion....

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Re: Wingfoil mast lenght

Postby kitenight11 » Mon Sep 30, 2019 12:36 pm

Thanks for the answers. So I will at least order a new 65cm mast and try again. Maybe it helps a little, even though, I thing 15cm less mast leenght does not change aa lot in drag? I thought pumping would be more efficiant because of the more direct feeling.
What size mast do you guys use mostly when winging?


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