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Next steps, whats the best progression?

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RichR2
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Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby RichR2 » Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:29 pm

As the weather slowly starts warming up many foilers are going to be thinking about their next steps this year, myself included. In most sports, building on existing skills progressively is the key to faster learning. While thinking about what to try to learn next, which for me is tacking, I began to think it would be better to focus first on some other moves (360 then Heel to toeside tack) rather than just going all out trying to do roll tacks. What are your thoughts? And how does this order look for a progression in kitefoiling? Would following it speed up your learning?
Riding upwind
Riding Downwind
Heel to toeside gybe
Riding toeside
Toeside to heelside gybe
Foot switch
360
Heel to toeside tack
Toeside to heelside tack
Tack with footswitch
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SWO_kite
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Re: Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby SWO_kite » Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:38 pm

So many guys are much better foil riders than me, but I'll reference what I did last year, at your stage:

Upwind and downwind riding should be obvious I hope. But beyond that, I focused on touching down, performing a foot switch then completing the gybe (both directions)

I've only got one year of foil riding under my belt, I'm still only 50% successful at gybes while maintaining speed. But that could also be the board I'm riding.

-----------------------------------------------EDIT-----------------------------------------------------
After giving your post a second read, I think you may be more advanced than I am too - LOL

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Re: Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby Jyoder » Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:57 pm

The amazing thing about foiling is that each step of progression feels like you’re attempting the impossible, but then somehow you learn to do it. I learned to tack with foot switch this year by committing hard: waterstart, count to 10 seconds, tack, crash, point other direction, repeat. And now I can do it and it is glorious, but in the end just another option not much more difficult than the rest.

Just pick your poison and commit to crash and repeat. Or not, I know some very good kitefoilers who never learned to switch feet and are fine with ripping that way. Up to you..

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Re: Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby dkazhdan » Wed Feb 19, 2020 7:03 pm

I've been riding for a year on a shinn p-foil. can do flying foot switches pretty consistently on both sides, but i figure its probably because of how slow this foil can go, i very much doubt i'd be able to pull it off on a faster/smaller wing.

I recently attempted a 360 but it feels like i'm years away from it, at this point, I can't even wrap my head around how the kite should move, finding it very counter-intuitive.

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Re: Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby windmaker » Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:09 pm

Jyoder wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:57 pm
Or not, I know some very good kitefoilers who never learned to switch feet and are fine with ripping that way. Up to you..
How can someone who can't switch feet, a basic but essential move, can be considered a VERY good kitefoiler ? Sure, just like, in the country of the blind the one-eyed are kings :D .

dkazhdan
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Re: Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby dkazhdan » Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:05 pm

windmaker wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:09 pm
Jyoder wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:57 pm
Or not, I know some very good kitefoilers who never learned to switch feet and are fine with ripping that way. Up to you..
How can someone who can't switch feet, a basic but essential move, can be considered a VERY good kitefoiler ? Sure, just like, in the country of the blind the one-eyed are kings :D .
we have a few guys riding race foils who do surface footswitches only. But then they jump 60 ft high... :)

RichR2
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Re: Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby RichR2 » Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:25 am

Jyoder wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:57 pm
The amazing thing about foiling is that each step of progression feels like you’re attempting the impossible, but then somehow you learn to do it. I learned to tack with foot switch this year by committing hard: waterstart, count to 10 seconds, tack, crash, point other direction, repeat. And now I can do it and it is glorious, but in the end just another option not much more difficult than the rest.

Just pick your poison and commit to crash and repeat. Or not, I know some very good kitefoilers who never learned to switch feet and are fine with ripping that way. Up to you..
Yes, committing "to crash and repeat" is inevitable but I'm quite keen to keeping it to a minimum 🤣🤣🤣...least pain for the greatest gain.

windmaker
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Re: Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby windmaker » Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:46 am

dkazhdan wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:05 pm
windmaker wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:09 pm
Jyoder wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:57 pm
Or not, I know some very good kitefoilers who never learned to switch feet and are fine with ripping that way. Up to you..
How can someone who can't switch feet, a basic but essential move, can be considered a VERY good kitefoiler ? Sure, just like, in the country of the blind the one-eyed are kings :D .
we have a few guys riding race foils who do surface footswitches only. But then they jump 60 ft high... :)
Agreed, but so they would with a TT too. In my book performing a flying jibe or tack is way harder than jumping, BTW a "racer" that can't air jibe or tack? What are the odds they could win a race against the 99% who can?

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Re: Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby cwood » Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:44 pm

RichR2 wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:25 am
Jyoder wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:57 pm
The amazing thing about foiling is that each step of progression feels like you’re attempting the impossible, but then somehow you learn to do it. I learned to tack with foot switch this year by committing hard: waterstart, count to 10 seconds, tack, crash, point other direction, repeat. And now I can do it and it is glorious, but in the end just another option not much more difficult than the rest.

Just pick your poison and commit to crash and repeat. Or not, I know some very good kitefoilers who never learned to switch feet and are fine with ripping that way. Up to you..
Yes, committing "to crash and repeat" is inevitable but I'm quite keen to keeping it to a minimum 🤣🤣🤣...least pain for the greatest gain.
So much this...the people that are never crashing and thrashing are not progressing. There are no short cuts....I have to force myself to be in the mindset in a session for pain and anguish....it is the only way my brain processes the complex inputs and outputs to slowly work toward success.

cwood
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Re: Next steps, whats the best progression?

Postby cwood » Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:50 pm

dkazhdan wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:05 pm
windmaker wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:09 pm
Jyoder wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:57 pm
Or not, I know some very good kitefoilers who never learned to switch feet and are fine with ripping that way. Up to you..
How can someone who can't switch feet, a basic but essential move, can be considered a VERY good kitefoiler ? Sure, just like, in the country of the blind the one-eyed are kings :D .
we have a few guys riding race foils who do surface footswitches only. But then they jump 60 ft high... :)
Ya don't want to be one of those.....In my mind the greatest respect is for people with "at will" foot switches and clean air tacks. 360's etc are dime a dozen, use them to get comfortable rotating under the kite and managing the disorientation etc. on the way to true tacking. What helped me progressing to flying gybes is first nailing the sequences of managing kite tension while carving to toe side and riding toe side, then the a late foot switch back to heel once you feel in control. That teaches you the board dynamics unweighted and the impact of kite unweighting you....that can be used to then intro foot switch at any time. For tacking, biggest issue for me was kite motions....helped me greatly to be in deep water off the board for a bit simulating tack motions of the kite just rotating my body in the water. Not as dangerous as doing it on land.


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