tomtom wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:54 pm
drsurf wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 24, 2020 2:57 pm
So if single skins are the answer to light wind kiting, and from my Peak4 experience in sizes up to 8m I can agree with that, what is the light wind limit of the new 13m Peak4 kite?
Very few have commented on how low this kite can go, but the comments that have been made are positive. And the video from Armin in the Maldives on the 13m looks to be in very light wind.
Anyone seen how low can you go?
I dont know if you are all *****. Peak is not light wind kite - it has very poor L/D to be LW kite. What part of this you dont understand? Sorry but i dont know how many times should i repeat this.
This is not my opinion its physical fact which should be obvious from just looking at the kite.
In plain english this low L/D mean it has very high drag a very low lift=pull. In light wind you need exact opposite. Its only advantage for LW is zenith stability. There are kites much better for this already.
Competent 10m UL medium aspect closed cell will have better low end than 13m Peak. What im talking about is non existent ultralite high aspect single skin which will have much better L/D than current peak and will have better zenith stability than todays best and lightest closed cells. L/D will be still better on closed cells but with balanced design and for lower /not racing/ speeds it should be o.k.
tomtom, in my experience and location you're wrong about the Peak4, it is a light wind kite. I was trying to think of a way to put it more diplomatically but whatever ***** meant led me to think I need to be more direct. By the way all of what I cover below relates to various kitefoilers a using a surf foil between 1000 and 1250 sq cm, (and a Zeeko Spitfire), with a wind strength measured by hand held and local meteorological wind meters of between 6 and 10 knots. Kiters weigh between 65kg and 85kg and 5m & 8m Peak4 kites.
In my experience many kiters including Peak4 kiters couldn't give a rats arse about the the L/D ratio. It's the experience of the way the Peak4 kite flies in comparison to other kites that matters to the end user. In case you think I lack the kites to compare, I sell the Flysurfer range and use the comparable "Competent 10m UL medium aspect closed cell" kite, a 10m Soul. In my experience and that of others the 8m Peak4 performs better in light winds for the criteria I've quoted than the 10m Soul.
If you want to go fast and for a long distance in a relatively straight line with a small surface area, high aspect ratio freeride or race foil, in light winds, the Soul is great. The apparent wind with the Soul will take you through lulls way below what you think you can kite in and for this activity L/D is a valid criteria. However a number of kiters at my local beach have similar kites to the Soul such as Ozone Hyperlinks in larger than 10m and they've been used a couple of times and rarely seen again even when the wind is light. The experience in light winds kiters in my local area want is enough power to get up on the foil, simplicity, ease of use, responsiveness, great gust handling, fast turning, fantastic drift for wave riding, ability to stay airborne in a big lull and an affordable price. In the light wind scenario I'm describing the Peak4 delivers in all these criteria. Just in case you think where I live is a freakish area with unusual kiters, because I sell the Peak4 kites well outside my local area I also get feedback from my customers, and you won't be surprised to hear that they like the Peak4 in light winds too. In the Peak4 thread you'll also find Peak4 kiters loving the light wind performance.
There are few kiters in Australia that can afford to pay $3000 plus for a lightwind twin skin kite with your "perfect" L/D ratios. If they would like to, please contact me as the new Flysurfer Sonic 3 is now out and I would love to sell some and have them out on the water in Australia
It seems the market here is a lot smaller for efficient, high aspect twin skin foils in my experience. Even if price was more competitive, the average LEI kitefoiler on a surf foil, given a choice between the characteristics of an appropriate size Peak4 and an efficient twin skin foil kite, would choose the Peak4.
Having come from an inland location many years ago, I can understand there is a different light wind criteria which applies which does favour an efficient, modern foil kite like the Soul. Having a kite which can fall to the water when the wind dies completely and then be relaunched 5 minutes later when a light breeze returns is great on an inland lake with erratic and light winds. But that's not the light wind criteria I'm addressing.
tomtom i respect a lot of your comments about the Peak4 as you have been a long time user and appreciate what the Peak4 can do. But when it comes to light wind kiting with criteria I've quoted you're way off. And when it comes to comparing L/D and user experience, the user wins just about every time.
BTW after banging on about light wind, for the last 3 days I've been riding the 3m Peak4 in 15 to 20+ knots on my Moses 679 surf foil - fantastic