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kites for foiling

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roggema
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kites for foiling

Postby roggema » Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:00 pm

Hi all,

could someone let me in a bit on benefits of specific kites for foiling?
I currently have a 9M Dice which I use for twintipping from 18-30 knots.

I imagine I can use this kite from let's say 12(?)-13 knots - 17ish on my foil. is this correct?

Then there's these single struts (Airush ultra 9m, Gong Unik's 9 or 10, Flysurfer peaks 5m) which also let you foil from approx 11(?) - 15 knots.
What's then the benefit of these kits other then in a lull they would be less likely to drop from the sky? in other words, is it worth the investment?

I do understand that for my 85kg and gong Pro M, for 9 knots I would need a 11m (?)single strut or foil spec this I get.

kind regards,
Maxime

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Re: kites for foiling

Postby Windigo1 » Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:05 pm

Lots of good single struts on the market now. I have an Airush Ultra 12m and a 9m Naish Boxer. The advantages are that it will stay in the air with much less wind if you loop it and keep it moving probably you can keep it up in 3 or 4 knots. I can ride in 6 knots with the Moses 633 and some foil pumping in the lulls. The lighter kite will drift and stay in the air when you go downwind in very light wind. Basically with the 12m if it stays in the air you can foil. I have been out so many times with good Riders on 3 strut kites and the difference is huge the heavier kites fall sooner and they won't relaunch many times when we are still riding on the signle struts.

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Re: kites for foiling

Postby HugoMC » Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:54 pm

Some good points and information above but I think relaunch is a massive factor in regards foiling.

My single strut relaunches so easily compared to my other kites 👍

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Re: kites for foiling

Postby matth » Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:17 am

Windigo1 wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:05 pm
Lots of good single struts on the market now. I have an Airush Ultra 12m and a 9m Naish Boxer. The advantages are that it will stay in the air with much less wind if you loop it and keep it moving probably you can keep it up in 3 or 4 knots. I can ride in 6 knots with the Moses 633 and some foil pumping in the lulls. The lighter kite will drift and stay in the air when you go downwind in very light wind. Basically with the 12m if it stays in the air you can foil. I have been out so many times with good Riders on 3 strut kites and the difference is huge the heavier kites fall sooner and they won't relaunch many times when we are still riding on the signle struts.

And the relaunch is much better, my Boxers have much better relaunch than my Pivots..

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Re: kites for foiling

Postby Foil » Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:52 am

matth wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:17 am
Windigo1 wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:05 pm
Lots of good single struts on the market now. I have an Airush Ultra 12m and a 9m Naish Boxer. The advantages are that it will stay in the air with much less wind if you loop it and keep it moving probably you can keep it up in 3 or 4 knots. I can ride in 6 knots with the Moses 633 and some foil pumping in the lulls. The lighter kite will drift and stay in the air when you go downwind in very light wind. Basically with the 12m if it stays in the air you can foil. I have been out so many times with good Riders on 3 strut kites and the difference is huge the heavier kites fall sooner and they won't relaunch many times when we are still riding on the signle struts.

And the relaunch is much better, my Boxers have much better relaunch than my Pivots..
2 points
as above- a single strut kite that is ultra light and in the right hands will relaunch very easily, i demoed a lot of different brands to find my choice over a year ago, for me the best was the ozone alpha,
this made a huge difference to my light wind foiling experience, and 6 months later then changed to ultra light foil kites, which are the ultimate light wind kites, but take time to become skilled enough to safely enjoy the benefits, so I do not recommend foil kites until some time near the point where you can foil for many hours without getting wet, then jump over to foils maybe.

I have to temper my enthusiasm for the Ozone alpha single strut after watching a relative newbie who was not able to light wind re launch his brand new one, unbelievable I was thinking , why is he struggling with re launch, conditions were perfect? well for me they were, but I had to remember I had taken time to learn the technique, just buying a super easy to relaunch light wind kite for foiling is not the magic trick, but buying one and taking time to learn the "twin front line uneven line re launch" is key to light wind happiness.
just tugging away on random lines like you can get away with in a good blow is not the answer, and single line re launch although will work well in the right amount of wind, its not the way to get these kites off the water in seagull fart strength wind.

check you kite weights, mega important to go as light as possible
my weights below were for kites new out of the box, just the kite, no wrappings or strap, real weight, not taken from a web site!

10mtr Alpha - 2.12 kg
12mtr Alpha - 2.45 kg

for ref, for future maybe.

5mtr hyperlink ul v1 - 1.29 kg
7mtr hyperlink v2 - 1.39 kg
9mtr chrono ul v3 - 1.62 kg
11mtr chrono ul v3 - 1.96Kg
remember true foil kites deliver the power of a much larger lei kite of the same quoted size, and generally have a much wider wind range, so the larger cost is diluted somewhat,
a 9mtr ul new generation foil kite for example will cover a wind range of at least 2 lei kites, and in the right hands will relaunch in winds a lei kite can never do, even the best one struts.

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Re: kites for foiling

Postby Kamikuza » Fri Jun 05, 2020 7:34 am

Depends how you like to ride — I like wave tubes and have zero interest in foil kites.

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Re: kites for foiling

Postby Wazza Foil » Fri Jun 05, 2020 8:06 am

Cloud kites, strutless with inflatable le
8m is 1.65 kg
10.4m is 1.9kg
Excellent drift and easy to relaunch with correct technique

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Re: kites for foiling

Postby matth » Fri Jun 05, 2020 1:33 pm

Foil wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:52 am
matth wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:17 am
Windigo1 wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:05 pm
Lots of good single struts on the market now. I have an Airush Ultra 12m and a 9m Naish Boxer. The advantages are that it will stay in the air with much less wind if you loop it and keep it moving probably you can keep it up in 3 or 4 knots. I can ride in 6 knots with the Moses 633 and some foil pumping in the lulls. The lighter kite will drift and stay in the air when you go downwind in very light wind. Basically with the 12m if it stays in the air you can foil. I have been out so many times with good Riders on 3 strut kites and the difference is huge the heavier kites fall sooner and they won't relaunch many times when we are still riding on the signle struts.

And the relaunch is much better, my Boxers have much better relaunch than my Pivots..
2 points
as above- a single strut kite that is ultra light and in the right hands will relaunch very easily, i demoed a lot of different brands to find my choice over a year ago, for me the best was the ozone alpha,
this made a huge difference to my light wind foiling experience, and 6 months later then changed to ultra light foil kites, which are the ultimate light wind kites, but take time to become skilled enough to safely enjoy the benefits, so I do not recommend foil kites until some time near the point where you can foil for many hours without getting wet, then jump over to foils maybe.

I have to temper my enthusiasm for the Ozone alpha single strut after watching a relative newbie who was not able to light wind re launch his brand new one, unbelievable I was thinking , why is he struggling with re launch, conditions were perfect? well for me they were, but I had to remember I had taken time to learn the technique, just buying a super easy to relaunch light wind kite for foiling is not the magic trick, but buying one and taking time to learn the "twin front line uneven line re launch" is key to light wind happiness.
just tugging away on random lines like you can get away with in a good blow is not the answer, and single line re launch although will work well in the right amount of wind, its not the way to get these kites off the water in seagull fart strength wind.

check you kite weights, mega important to go as light as possible
my weights below were for kites new out of the box, just the kite, no wrappings or strap, real weight, not taken from a web site!

10mtr Alpha - 2.12 kg
12mtr Alpha - 2.45 kg

for ref, for future maybe.

5mtr hyperlink ul v1 - 1.29 kg
7mtr hyperlink v2 - 1.39 kg
9mtr chrono ul v3 - 1.62 kg
11mtr chrono ul v3 - 1.96Kg
remember true foil kites deliver the power of a much larger lei kite of the same quoted size, and generally have a much wider wind range, so the larger cost is diluted somewhat,
a 9mtr ul new generation foil kite for example will cover a wind range of at least 2 lei kites, and in the right hands will relaunch in winds a lei kite can never do, even the best one struts.

Boxers also have a mesh near the tips for drainage that helps with relaunch....nice feature..

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Re: kites for foiling

Postby HugoMC » Fri Jun 05, 2020 2:06 pm

matth wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 1:33 pm
Foil wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:52 am
matth wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:17 am



And the relaunch is much better, my Boxers have much better relaunch than my Pivots..
2 points
as above- a single strut kite that is ultra light and in the right hands will relaunch very easily, i demoed a lot of different brands to find my choice over a year ago, for me the best was the ozone alpha,
this made a huge difference to my light wind foiling experience, and 6 months later then changed to ultra light foil kites, which are the ultimate light wind kites, but take time to become skilled enough to safely enjoy the benefits, so I do not recommend foil kites until some time near the point where you can foil for many hours without getting wet, then jump over to foils maybe.

I have to temper my enthusiasm for the Ozone alpha single strut after watching a relative newbie who was not able to light wind re launch his brand new one, unbelievable I was thinking , why is he struggling with re launch, conditions were perfect? well for me they were, but I had to remember I had taken time to learn the technique, just buying a super easy to relaunch light wind kite for foiling is not the magic trick, but buying one and taking time to learn the "twin front line uneven line re launch" is key to light wind happiness.
just tugging away on random lines like you can get away with in a good blow is not the answer, and single line re launch although will work well in the right amount of wind, its not the way to get these kites off the water in seagull fart strength wind.

check you kite weights, mega important to go as light as possible
my weights below were for kites new out of the box, just the kite, no wrappings or strap, real weight, not taken from a web site!

10mtr Alpha - 2.12 kg
12mtr Alpha - 2.45 kg

for ref, for future maybe.

5mtr hyperlink ul v1 - 1.29 kg
7mtr hyperlink v2 - 1.39 kg
9mtr chrono ul v3 - 1.62 kg
11mtr chrono ul v3 - 1.96Kg
remember true foil kites deliver the power of a much larger lei kite of the same quoted size, and generally have a much wider wind range, so the larger cost is diluted somewhat,
a 9mtr ul new generation foil kite for example will cover a wind range of at least 2 lei kites, and in the right hands will relaunch in winds a lei kite can never do, even the best one struts.

Boxers also have a mesh near the tips for drainage that helps with relaunch....nice feature..
Had always wondered the reason for that 😂 great feature. Does it work?

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Re: kites for foiling

Postby jumptheshark » Fri Jun 05, 2020 2:14 pm

I rate the mesh near the tips as a valid concept for helping light wind relaunch. I think there should likely also be a small drain at the base of single struts at the LE. Nothing big, just the size of a nickel on either side of the strut to let the water out. In some cases a bit of water trapped between the canopy and LE can prevent what would otherwise be a pretty easy reverse relaunch.
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