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Large foil floats, any ideas?

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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby Peter_Frank » Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:00 pm

Try to practice - you might surprise yourself, if you superman pointing sidewind, instead of upwind :thumb:

Even the Peak4 11 m2 which is not known for upwind abilities, can be parked at a lower angle because of low weight, which helps immensely.

And the OP had the problem in high winds, here pointing upwind is even worse and leads to disastrous results :o

8) Peter

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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby Trent hink » Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:12 pm

My foil/board combo always lies on its side. Although i have witnessed it sailing upwind, i have never had any problem chasing it down.

In marginal wind it can't sail upwind very fast. Sometimes in those conditions i will swim a bit, just to get back to it more quickly.

I like the fact that my board sits on its side because it seems to make strapless waterstarts much easier.

I suppose it might depend on the specific board-foil combination how much of a problem this really is.

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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby jaros » Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:12 pm

In lighter winds i rather swim with my kite at 12 oclock, than "classic"bodydrag. I get to the board quicker this way.
Btw, I like the non sinking foils more than the sinking ones. It is much nicer to straples start. Sometimes i dont even need hands, just put my feet on the board and start. It is also better when you go out of the water to the beach, even in shallow water the wings dont touch the ground.
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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby BigSky » Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:21 pm

Good question, Peter. I consider myself to be a good body dragger. I don't try to go straight upwind but, rather, work my way there through tacking. I was on a Peak4 4m. Let me be clear. The board, on it's side, hauled ass almost straight upwind at a clip of 8 to 10 kts. I chased it several hundred yards and came close but realized I was putting my safety at risk. The water was 43 F (6C) and I found myself several hundred yards offshore without a board. I literally dragged myself to shore at a good clip (you know, when you're skipping along the surface and your boots almost come off), dumped the kite and ran to the boat. By the time I found it the board was close to 1/2 mile away, still moving at a clip on it's side.

I guess I could see liking it for strapless water starts but other than that it feels like a design error. That was the most disappointing $960 spend of my life. I do need to try it with a different board. The Kanaha shapes boards always veer hard left and go on their side after a wipeout. I have a Groove skate I will try. That one always comes gunning for my teeth after a wipeout. :o

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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby Jfactor » Tue Jun 16, 2020 11:43 pm

BigSky wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:21 pm
Good question, Peter. I consider myself to be a good body dragger. I don't try to go straight upwind but, rather, work my way there through tacking. I was on a Peak4 4m. Let me be clear. The board, on it's side, hauled ass almost straight upwind at a clip of 8 to 10 kts. I chased it several hundred yards and came close but realized I was putting my safety at risk. The water was 43 F (6C) and I found myself several hundred yards offshore without a board. I literally dragged myself to shore at a good clip (you know, when you're skipping along the surface and your boots almost come off), dumped the kite and ran to the boat. By the time I found it the board was close to 1/2 mile away, still moving at a clip on it's side.

I guess I could see liking it for strapless water starts but other than that it feels like a design error. That was the most disappointing $960 spend of my life. I do need to try it with a different board. The Kanaha shapes boards always veer hard left and go on their side after a wipeout. I have a Groove skate I will try. That one always comes gunning for my teeth after a wipeout. :o
I think I misunderstand your terminology "at a clip of 8 to 10knts". Are you suggesting your board was going upwind at 8-10knts? If so, that's not possible. High performance sailboats that are intended to sail upwind, do 10knts on a good day, and they're sailing at 45° to the wind. At 8-10knots it would have a wake! I think a more reasonable estimate would be 0.5knots, which might be just enough to remain out of reach. I get dead downwind of the foil, park the kite at 12, and swim to it. With a small peak, it's easier to do this rather than attempt body dragging for 30min.

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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby BigSky » Wed Jun 17, 2020 12:11 am

You're one of the those guys, huh? Okay, call it 5 kts. The wind was nuking and hitting the side of the board (foil was on the downwind side) at what appeared to be a perfect angle and the board took off. There was a small wake. I can body drag, especially in high winds, far fast than I can swim. I will say I don't find the Peak4 as efficient as the Soul for gaining ground.

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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby Trent hink » Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:50 am

I could see this maybe happening in a flat-water spot with strong winds.

But with some normal chop it seems unlikely that it would be impossible to get back to the board.

On the other hand, have had friends describe the same problem.

So, maybe there is some solution that works by adjusting the gear, rather than adjusting rider skill.

I myself, am only marginally competent with a hydrofoil. I have no problems.

Also, shout out to Jaros, it seems we have a very similar grasp of reality! Lol.

Maybe I just lucked out and got a combination of gear that works well.

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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby Brian H » Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:18 am

I’ve been out 3 times now on my Groove Skate M with a 200 lift surf , it’s stays on its side for ever , when this is the biggest problem is when you do a racer style gybe where you switch your feet before the turn and you blow it , your board is gone and yes I remember how to body drag . When you start learning to do foiling foot switches before the turn you will understand.

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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby Whattheflock » Wed Jun 17, 2020 5:14 am

In marginal winds I just swim backward to it with the kite around 12, it's pretty painless. If I'm powered up, just body drag to it.. haven't had too much issue yet. I just picked up my floaty 633 though.

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Re: Large foil floats, any ideas?

Postby foam-n-fibre » Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:42 am

I've had a board/foil combo that tracks off pretty well, but a newer board I have with the same foil does not have balanced wind load and so it turns more and does not go in a straight line. I love this feature of my board, it's always ready for launch, but I can see it would be less good when its really strong.

You need to change the balance of this. You need a "spoiler" on the tail of the board on the deck, at least on each rail. Maybe part of a rounded plastic jug fixed on the back with a footstrap hole? Sounds a bit odd, but it would be worth an experiment. If your board is bottom to the wind, it would turn the board downwind so it would not be exposed to the wind as much and would not point as high. Maybe if that works you could try an oversize EVA foam kick tail on the tail near each rail which would slow and turn the board. It would look less dorky and might be safer to fall on. You could give the board a good push in shallow calm water to test this out.

BTW, if the board was a half mile away in 15 minutes that would be 2 mph. But there is no doubt that a board and foil could point higher upwind than you can bodydrag.

Peter


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