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High wind foiling

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jumptheshark
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Re: High wind foiling

Postby jumptheshark » Sat Oct 24, 2020 5:27 pm

Yeah man, overdress.

Its fall, Im in a winter suit.

Getting cold sucks, you play it too safe.

You will be stoked with your new kite when you get to use it..... which is likely soon, because.... well, foiling!

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Re: High wind foiling

Postby Flyboy » Sat Oct 24, 2020 6:47 pm

jumptheshark wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 5:27 pm
Yeah man, overdress.

Its fall, Im in a winter suit.

Getting cold sucks, you play it too safe.

You will be stoked with your new kite when you get to use it..... which is likely soon, because.... well, foiling!
Yesterday: 27C. Forecast 20 - 25 knots SW. Wind at the lake 5 knots max. Doming. :-?

Today: 7C. :cry:

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Re: High wind foiling

Postby Janus » Sat Oct 24, 2020 8:10 pm

True.. but you can get really warm.. at least with a Peak4.. today a flat water session with 1200 wing and 5m.. tried some pumping.. managed and was getting really warm. 8)

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Re: High wind foiling

Postby Flyboy » Sat Oct 24, 2020 8:22 pm

Janus wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 8:10 pm
True.. but you can get really warm.. at least with a Peak4.. today a flat water session with 1200 wing and 5m.. tried some pumping.. managed and was getting really warm. 8)
Foiling = long periods of zipping along upright fully exposed to the windchill ... followed by a periodic violent crash with a thorough wetsuit flushing. :(

I've never really regretted a cold weather, highwind SB session - you always end reasonably warm because of the intensity of the activity ... until you stop & get cold really fast on the beach.

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Re: High wind foiling

Postby purdyd » Sat Oct 24, 2020 9:49 pm

Besides weight the no strut kites can flatten out when depowered and you can really dump the power. Even more so than a single strut kite.

This has really helped me on a wave or swell where you can build up a lot of apparent speed.

The really small kites, 3m, have a higher weight to area aka density and aren’t quite as floaty as the bigger brothers.

The small kites don’t have a lot of parked pull, but they an produce a lot of power from moving around. And as mentioned if you want to get warm, take a 3m out in 16 knots.

The problem with flying in those conditions, small kite at bottom of range is there is no margin if the wind drops.

It is astonishing how small of a kite you can use if you try it,

I’ve seen all kinds of kite sizes in the same wind. I am reluctant to recommend a kite size to anyone I don’t know.

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Re: High wind foiling

Postby muitomaluco » Sat Oct 24, 2020 10:49 pm

Reading this thread made me think about trying out a flysurfer viron 4m on the foilboard. Bought one last year for snowkiting in storms, but could not try that out due to corona virus, so I just tried it with Inlineskates... Super easy, super smooth...

Just found some videos on youtube of guys foiling a 4m Viron. I guess there is no 4m kite with a smoother power deliery than the Viron...
I wonder why I never thought about trying it on the foil!

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Re: High wind foiling

Postby Alysum » Sun Oct 25, 2020 12:45 am

jumptheshark wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 1:00 pm
I have to respectfully disagree. Over the last few seasons I have experimented foiling in higher winds with five, three, single, strutless and Peak4s. In sizes 9,8.5,8,7,6.25,6,5,4,3.5 and 3m.

I remember being stoked holding a 9m 5 strut Rally into 20 knots and feeling like I'd found something completely new! Eventually, with more experience and skill, you realize the same advantages that make the lighter kites a better option in light winds are at play in winds over 20 knots. The speeds at which you ride down wind/swell are fast and absolutely bring weight front and centre to performance and freedom of movement.

You are correct that above 20, everything will work, but extra struts and extra weight don't make a kite turn faster. Smaller kites turn faster! Struts give more solid structure on the high end, but they have diminishing returns as the canopy size starts to get below 6m. For those truly unwilling to drop the struts, a single strut is more than enough in kites 5m and down. Still, they drift, recover and purposefully stall back nothing like even lighter and smaller kites. The difference in dexterity and depower makes for a pretty different overall experience. Like many venturing into higher winds on foil, I spent a fair bit of time overpowered on three strut 6m kites. Eventually you find yourself in waves you are willing and able to take advantage of on foil only to realize your kite won't let you go and do what you want. The moment you try, you have way too much power. You can safely go out there in among these phat tantalizing swells, but can't actually ride any. This is a truly agonizing moment and generally once is enough to get you shopping for something that will let you ride the way you want. Sizing down in both weight and canopy opens the options right back up to where they were in less wind and you realize that three strut kites really have no place in high wind foiling. They can be used just as any kite "CAN" be used but eventually, you won't bother. You will either go back to surfboards an miss out, or buy in and get a 3m.
Some good points here.

What would be some recommendation on single strut foiling kites for 5m and below? Naish boxer?
I love my ozone alpha 8m but there's nothing below 6m available in shops.

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Re: High wind foiling

Postby OzBungy » Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:08 am

I believe most small LEI have a single strut because there is simply much less material to support. You don't need a lot of struts. You don't simply scale down a 5 strut kite and keep all the struts and call it a high wind kite.

I wear a 6mm suit with hood for half the year. The lower physical exertion is one part of it. I think a bigger factor is you stay dry up on the foil and crashes are relatively rare. Every fall is the equivalent of that full flush when you first get in the water.

I wear much thinner suits winging because I work much harder and fall more often.

I our 45C summer days I have found it is much cooler to wear a wet wetsuiit. I usually keep my suit on while packing, and start the car with the air conditioning while I change.

Apart from being warm is more comfortable, I view a wetsuit as an essential survival aid. You can survive much longer in cool water wearing a decent wetsuit. The added buoyancy is a bonus.

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Re: High wind foiling

Postby mar menor » Sun Oct 25, 2020 2:17 pm

What would be some recommendation on single strut foiling kites for 5m and below? Naish boxer?
I love my ozone alpha 8m but there's nothing below 6m available in shops.
[/quote]

There is a 4m in the new CATALYST V3,which is SINGLE STRUT maybe there will be a 4 in the new V2 Alpha,though the 'cat' will no doubt be less expensive and in the smaller sizes weight should not be an issue,

CATALYST V3
"Derived from the very popular Alpha V1 design with refinements to enhance durability, performance and accessibility for entry level to intermediate riders."

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Re: High wind foiling

Postby Peter_Frank » Sun Oct 25, 2020 3:11 pm

Flyboy wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 8:22 pm
Janus wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 8:10 pm
True.. but you can get really warm.. at least with a Peak4.. today a flat water session with 1200 wing and 5m.. tried some pumping.. managed and was getting really warm. 8)
Foiling = long periods of zipping along upright fully exposed to the windchill ... followed by a periodic violent crash with a thorough wetsuit flushing. :(

I've never really regretted a cold weather, highwind SB session - you always end reasonably warm because of the intensity of the activity ... until you stop & get cold really fast on the beach.

A bit off topic, but agree fully, you are much warmer on a waveboard, than a foil, because you work harder and your full body, as opposed to foil where you don't use (I don't) use your body as aggressive.

On a foil when you fall, you get all flushed :rollgrin:

So wear a lot warmer suit for foiling, unless in summer where shorts are just fine for both.

8) Peter


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