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I was expecting to see Fred attach this to his 100cm Dwarfcraft..

Fred has been photographed using the Phantasm setup but at the competition looks like he reverted to:
Slingshot Ghost Whisperer (Moses manfactured) 111 mast
Slingshot Ghost Whisperer (Moses Manufactured) 647 fuselage (re anodised red)
Slingshot Ghost Whisperer (Moses Manufactured) 330 stabiliser
Slingshot Phantasm 657 front wing (I think). Its not a moses 590 or 695. 657 seems to be a bigger 590..... which is Fred's normal front wing of choice....

Sorry, cant help myself and will get spanked for saying this...

But Fred Hope is one of the best foilers out there, or maybe "the" best if we use the results.

And so many think his chosen quiver can make them "the" best, getting the same gear

Same thing as back in the 80's windsurfing - it was the gear and not the rider, of course

Peter

@ Peter ... second best will do at my age.

Naw, I don't think anyone truly thinks that gear will make them "Foil Like Fred." I do think that Fred can ride whatever he wants, and therefore puts together the package he likes best. That DOES tell the consumer something: anything from "I want that exact setup," to perhaps "if he's riding that, I'll want something slower" etc. He carries A LOT of speed into his maneuvers--that's his style. I would say his stability comes more from inertia/speed, than wing stability. He is so easy to spot in Hood River just on his speed alone, never mind the special effect moves he pulls off.

Peter_Frank wrote: Sorry, cant help myself and will get spanked for saying this...

But Fred Hope is one of the best foilers out there, or maybe "the" best if we use the results.

And so many think his chosen quiver can make them "the" best, getting the same gear

Same thing as back in the 80's windsurfing - it was the gear and not the rider, of course

Peter

funny coming from the guy who writes novel length posts about foiling gear.

i’m looking for a non-duotone auto-unspin bar for foiling with a long throw and slingshot incorrectly shows that’s what fred used so i asked.

i’m looking for gear for free ride and and wave type of kite performance but i guess i should follow your posts about race wings and slow pig turning foil kites because i won’t be as good as fred if i use the gear he uses.

I am being partly ironic of course

But only partly, as there are always many, especially youngsters, who want to ride the precise gear those winning competition's ride.

Nothing wrong with that, just an observation, and a bit funny for freestyle disciplines

Peter

Fred has been riding 590 for last three years and switching the wing to slightly larger 657. Both of these configurations are awesome freeride set and people can learn and progress on those. It’s not the gear that is limiting factor

And if Moses went a tad faster on 550->548->590->695 path we could have had larger wing for kite foiling at least a year earlier. Yet 590 did well and what a great three years it’s been since it was introduced about this time back in 2017.

Anyone using the 657 yet or seen one? I'm interested in the dimensions such as chord and area...I take it the span is 657. Just wondering how higher the aspect ratio is and if this is the way we're going to see wing development go now that riders who learnt on the low aspect wings can manoeuvre on the foil. Wing foils seem to going for higher aspect too.

RichR2 wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 29, 2020 8:05 pm

Anyone using the 657 yet or seen one? I'm interested in the dimensions such as chord and area...I take it the span is 657. Just wondering how higher the aspect ratio is and if this is the way we're going to see wing development go now that riders who learnt on the low aspect wings can manoeuvre on the foil. Wing foils seem to going for higher aspect too.

I saw 657, the one Fred rides. Imagine 590 but with longer wingspan - there goes the 657.

Going from lower aspect to higher aspect wing, at same wing area, you get increased wing efficiency, increased roll stability, but also increased stall speed. You don’t lose foil agility, it rather feels as roll stability gain while you can push the wing to turn just fine - I can still carve all I want riding my 800 and I love the wing. And maybe because 800 is (windsurf) race wing with proper geometry. The 695 and 720 wings felt good too. Higher aspect is a winning direction and we’re getting larger area wings which helps lowend.
Win-win