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Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

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rnelias
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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby rnelias » Thu May 13, 2021 2:42 am

Gestalt wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 9:21 pm
I have used an 8m Aluula Roam in sub 10 knots with success on a 1000cm2 foil. It's a slight challenge but can still be fun.
At those low wind speed dropping the kite in the water in lull's will happen and this kite is easy to relaunch unlike ufo's/clouds/etc.
The kite is still incredibly nimble and agile at that wind speed.
I also tried the same kite on a larger 1700cm2 surf wing, and it was ridiculously easy to cruise around.

Friend of mine had even a bigger wing and was having fun on a 7m UFO, walking the dog, etc.

I am guessing 10m Aluula Roam, may just be the sweet spot for sub-10 knots, as it's still fast enough to be playful as a kite and have the necessary pull.

Check this video of Reece kiting with the 10m Aluula Roam in sub 5 knots.
...
the only and main problem of Aluula kites, at least for me, is the price :(

For hydrofoil purposes, where the load is usually small, you don't even need a brand new kite. A good second hand kite would do the job pretty well :wink:

A new kite would be justified If you intend to jump or do long journeys offshore where the equipment should not fail...

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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby joriws » Thu May 13, 2021 3:51 am

bragnouff wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 9:34 pm
Gestalt wrote:
Wed May 12, 2021 9:21 pm
(...)

Check this video of Reece kiting with the 10m Aluula Roam in sub 5 knots.
Sub 5 knots, yeah right!
I'm sure the Aluula is a great super light kite, but no need to overpimp it with claims like that... 5kts is f*ck all.
By the way, there is what looks like an Ozone kite further upwind that also flies in that wind.
After aluula *marketing* claims the real truth? A water carpet.


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geokite
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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby geokite » Thu May 13, 2021 4:40 am

A bit of context should be given to that video. I am the 'Steve' referenced (flying a 6m Kitech). The wind dropped from 15mph to about 8mph, with lulls to 5mph, hence why I'm walking. I expect the 17m Aluula kite went down in one of these lulls. Thomas is a very experienced flier, and you can see he barely got out of the water. Boris can foil in a fart of wind, so ignore what he is doing with that peak...

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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby bragnouff » Thu May 13, 2021 5:00 am

Well, here again, claiming that the Peak rider was riding in 4kts is kind of dubious. I'm sure you can fly through some 4kts lulls, but there has to be a bit more wind somewhere to get going. Can see some more ripples and gusts in the middle of the spot, maybe it's a channel with some outgoing tide helping, or a gradient of wind making it a bit stronger higher up... Good on you all for chasing the low end, but when someone asks what would compliment his 9m UFO in the low 7-10kts range, it's probably not that helpful to have people coming with stuff like "I ride my 5 Peak at 7kts, ... my aluuuuula 10 at 5kts, ... a Peak 8 at 4kts...

Rant over... I don't care, I got wind.

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lederhosen
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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby lederhosen » Thu May 13, 2021 7:43 am

geokite wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 4:40 am
A bit of context should be given to that video. I am the 'Steve' referenced (flying a 6m Kitech). The wind dropped from 15mph to about 8mph, with lulls to 5mph, hence why I'm walking. I expect the 17m Aluula kite went down in one of these lulls. Thomas is a very experienced flier, and you can see he barely got out of the water. Boris can foil in a fart of wind, so ignore what he is doing with that peak...
Ha, Flysurfer must love this clip. What is your windrange on the kitech 6m?
Have you tried the Peak and can you compare it to your kitech 6m?

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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby joriws » Thu May 13, 2021 9:41 am

geokite wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 4:40 am
A bit of context should be given to that video. I am the 'Steve' referenced (flying a 6m Kitech). The wind dropped from 15mph to about 8mph, with lulls to 5mph, hence why I'm walking. I expect the 17m Aluula kite went down in one of these lulls. Thomas is a very experienced flier, and you can see he barely got out of the water. Boris can foil in a fart of wind, so ignore what he is doing with that peak...
Thanks for the insight what happened. In my quoting the video is highlighting the problem in ULW (ultra light wind aka single digit wind in knots). The thread topic hints to this area of wind, and someone start promoting that aluula will do it. The biggest problem is like on video that you cannot relaunch typical LEI including aluula in those winds. There is a minute lull in the wind and down you go and to relaunch you need 12+ knots of wind. This is not due to kite's weight (mostly) but bad airframe of LEI-kite design. Higher the wind gradient is the worse the situation is for LEIs..

Relaunch requires backstalling the airframe, as simple as that. With 'normal' LEI backstall area in oversheeting is very minor wing tip area where as foil kite whole TE can be backstalled and flied in reverse like a proper stunt kite. Flysurfer has tried to address this backstall problem with LW-sizes of Boost LEI with bridled trailing end on 15/18m.

The double skin ozone foil is flying fast on the loop so there is wind, and Peak also requires wind. With that loop ozone foilkite with 15m should be riding as well.

Now if we compare aluula's marketing point - the weight of fabric:
- Aluula 78-82g/sqm composite
- Penta TX 130g/sqm (let's combine Duotone "light" weight fabric here)
- Peak's cloth: canopy x-light 32g/sqm and leading edge dlx+ 44g/sqm

So topic most fun kite under 10 knots must be kite getting you riding, staying airborne in lulls, relaunching if needed.

Geokite, could you compare FRS 6m to Peak4 8m, is there a lot of impulse power difference (getting from water to board and accelerating to foil flying speed)?

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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby Tsachi1 » Thu May 13, 2021 1:08 pm

bragnouff wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 5:00 am
. Good on you all for chasing the low end, but when someone asks what would compliment his 9m UFO in the low 7-10kts range, it's probably not that helpful to have people coming with stuff like "I ride my 5 Peak at 7kts, ... my aluuuuula 10 at 5kts, ... a Peak 8 at 4kts...

Yep
Some will also ride 3 strut kites in 7-8 knots , but will it be suitable and fun ? Probably not .
I'm trying to find the kite which will give enough power , and fun during the ride in this winds , and if reluanch is possible is a plus , but not a must , since chances are low imo in those winds with any kite .

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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby Tsachi1 » Thu May 13, 2021 1:13 pm

matanshapira wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 12:30 am
Ideally, one would use a large high aspect foil because it allows higher speed to allow going upwind with a smaller kite, and glide which keeps you flying in transitions and lulls. Speed and glide should make it more fun as it will allow to do things like a 360, sitting on the board. Also will allow an easier water start and pumping in lulls and in inaccurate transitions.
Even a larger low aspect foil can improve the experience.
Longer lines will allow using a smaller kite, increasing the fun factor and allowing an easy water start. But with longer lines alone I was still unable to go upwind with a 10.4 kite in 7-8 knots. I think a larger foil would've made it.
You can try my large P27 wing plus extensions, see if it makes a big difference.
If you with your experience and 1.5 meter kite bigger then mine , struggle to go in this winds , I doubt I would be able.

Anyways would be happy to try , are you planing to come today ?

rnelias
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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby rnelias » Thu May 13, 2021 1:26 pm

joriws wrote:
Thu May 13, 2021 9:41 am
...
Thanks for the insight what happened. In my quoting the video is highlighting the problem in ULW (ultra light wind aka single digit wind in knots). The thread topic hints to this area of wind, and someone start promoting that aluula will do it. The biggest problem is like on video that you cannot relaunch typical LEI including aluula in those winds. There is a minute lull in the wind and down you go and to relaunch you need 12+ knots of wind. This is not due to kite's weight (mostly) but bad airframe of LEI-kite design. Higher the wind gradient is the worse the situation is for LEIs..

...
my experience relaunching the Alpha 8m in low winds (<10k) were actually very good. You can even relaunch it backwards by pulling the back lines. In fact, these ultralight LEIs are hard to crash into the water or backstall. In lulls you just leave the bar free and pull the center lines that it will climb to zenith.

We should also consider what's "fun" in ULW. In my case, I think it's a nice challenge to ride in ULW while people is watching with their pigs landed onshore :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Most fun kite in sub 10 knots and a surf wing

Postby jumptheshark » Thu May 13, 2021 2:05 pm

I guess the "fun" aspect is pretty individual.

Esp with foiling in light wind as there is always the possibility for a swim.

Swam twice yesterday, but when it was on it was good, so feels like it was worth it.

Had a big kite on residual waves session just the other day and it was super fun too, but that was all the swell.

After a few flat days, it can be sweet just to get out, but if the wind has been decent, my fun threshold climbs north of 10 knots pretty quick.


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