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How to get out with full on-shore winds

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leeuwen
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How to get out with full on-shore winds

Postby leeuwen » Mon May 24, 2021 8:53 am

Hi,

Yesterday I was out and the wind became full on-shore.
I could not get far enough out shore to get on the foil for probably 20 minutes when I got lucky and was able to start.

Any tips on getting up wind while body dragging?
I tried body dragging with the foil both upwind and downwind from me but I just could not get upwind with it.

Note that I am on a wave/foil kite that probably sits a bit deeper in the window. Should I just forget about going out with full on-shore or is there a technique I am missing?

Thx


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Re: How to get out with full on-shore winds

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon May 24, 2021 10:15 pm

No problem getting out, no matter which kite you got.

Take some more time to learn this basic skill.

Many ways to do it - but I always have my board to windward of me, or my body a bit over the board.

8) Peter

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Re: How to get out with full on-shore winds

Postby HugoMC » Mon May 24, 2021 10:26 pm

Get good at bodydragging with a foilboard.

We have lots of people taking up swimming now.... It is a new craze in Ireland so body dragging out is great to get away from swimmers to get up and going on the foil.

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Re: How to get out with full on-shore winds

Postby Foil » Tue May 25, 2021 6:41 am

My local beach is one of the hardest to get out from to deep water for a long mast pop up and fast start,
heavy waves want to roll you over back to the shallows then roll you over again which of course can cause line slack and the resulting kite drops into nasty turbulent water that rolls you round all over the place, sounds familiar? bloody knightmare.
It took me over 18months to crack it, so hard to learn how to beat the problem of direct onshore winds with overhead breaking waves coming at you from all directions, using my 101 mast was making it harder but then easier once out, as I had to get further out to deeper water for the initial start! but then the long mast was a great help once up, as I needed to stay high up above the next wave crests that were coming towards me fast and hard,
I have great sympathy for anyone having to cope with this in their first year of foiling as I know just how hard it is to master the skill set required to beat the conditions and get out past the rough water to open sea, some try to avoid these conditions and some never master the skill required to beat it.
My tips to make it easier are - use a small board like a 120 or 110 with foot straps front and rear, small board so you can duck under the oncoming breaking waves with your hand gripping hard through the front upper strap whilst your body is hard up against the board and outstretched to act like a rudder for directional stability,footstraps help a lot as without them your feet can more easily be washed off the board but a hard fast wave breaking over the board in the first few seconds of getting going, it helps to have a helmet and peaked cap to deflect the water and make it easier to duck under the waves sets.never try to ride over the top of any of the waves that are breaking, that is bad and often ends in a bad roll over backwards :nono: ,
don't go out underpowered, you need power to punch through the powerful fast moving waves going into the beach.
start off by powering up the kite and diving fast forward full body out stretched with board and body locked together as one to gain momentum and get into a rhythm moving forward through the sets and mush, kite pulling forward at around 45deg and small tiny sine wave movements for extra power, not too low and not too high, keep speed up, even slightly leaning over on the board in the flatter bits to keep up forward drive between the crests but not as you dive under or over the next crest as that can roll you over back to shore in a mess.
a foil kite helps a lot getting out, but works against you if you are not 100% at ease with foil kite handling,mixing the two skills together whilst still not an expert in foil kite use is a disaster waiting to happen.
once out past the bigger white water then spot a clear calmer bit of water and very quickly slip feet into straps whilst at the same time starting a quick power stroke to pop you up high and fast, and get going quickly to steer through the mass of white water and confused mess, a tall mast makes this so much easier,
just keep practicing and never give up, its not easy, but once cracked you wonder why you found it so hard to do.
of course the conditions I have described above are not easy and should not be the conditions you have a go at whilst still learning the basics, ok I know I did,and it was hard,with many many failed attempts, better to master easier conditions first.
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Re: How to get out with full on-shore winds

Postby junebug » Tue May 25, 2021 1:50 pm

Foil wrote:
Tue May 25, 2021 6:41 am
My local beach is one of the hardest to get out from to deep water for a long mast pop up and fast start,
heavy waves want to roll you over back to the shallows then roll you over again which of course can cause line slack and the resulting kite drops into nasty turbulent water that rolls you round all over the place, sounds familiar? bloody knightmare.
It took me over 18months to crack it, so hard to learn how to beat the problem of direct onshore winds with overhead breaking waves coming at you from all directions, using my 101 mast was making it harder but then easier once out, as I had to get further out to deeper water for the initial start! but then the long mast was a great help once up, as I needed to stay high up above the next wave crests that were coming towards me fast and hard,
I have great sympathy for anyone having to cope with this in their first year of foiling as I know just how hard it is to master the skill set required to beat the conditions and get out past the rough water to open sea, some try to avoid these conditions and some never master the skill required to beat it.
My tips to make it easier are - use a small board like a 120 or 110 with foot straps front and rear, small board so you can duck under the oncoming breaking waves with your hand gripping hard through the front upper strap whilst your body is hard up against the board and outstretched to act like a rudder for directional stability,footstraps help a lot as without them your feet can more easily be washed off the board but a hard fast wave breaking over the board in the first few seconds of getting going, it helps to have a helmet and peaked cap to deflect the water and make it easier to duck under the waves sets.never try to ride over the top of any of the waves that are breaking, that is bad and often ends in a bad roll over backwards :nono: ,
don't go out underpowered, you need power to punch through the powerful fast moving waves going into the beach.
start off by powering up the kite and diving fast forward full body out stretched with board and body locked together as one to gain momentum and get into a rhythm moving forward through the sets and mush, kite pulling forward at around 45deg and small tiny sine wave movements for extra power, not too low and not too high, keep speed up, even slightly leaning over on the board in the flatter bits to keep up forward drive between the crests but not as you dive under or over the next crest as that can roll you over back to shore in a mess.
a foil kite helps a lot getting out, but works against you if you are not 100% at ease with foil kite handling,mixing the two skills together whilst still not an expert in foil kite use is a disaster waiting to happen.
once out past the bigger white water then spot a clear calmer bit of water and very quickly slip feet into straps whilst at the same time starting a quick power stroke to pop you up high and fast, and get going quickly to steer through the mass of white water and confused mess, a tall mast makes this so much easier,
just keep practicing and never give up, its not easy, but once cracked you wonder why you found it so hard to do.
of course the conditions I have described above are not easy and should not be the conditions you have a go at whilst still learning the basics, ok I know I did,and it was hard,with many many failed attempts, better to master easier conditions first.
Respect

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Re: How to get out with full on-shore winds

Postby bkkite » Tue May 25, 2021 8:39 pm

Similar question to people above, what isn't working with body dragging? I've found that going upwind body dragging with a foil is way easier than with a twin tip. If the water is shallow, I just role the board on its side, and then find the sweet spot of where I need to lay on the board in order for it to not go too far up wind, since the foil wants to push up (towards the wind).

It works well enough that I've done it not even laying on the board, just kinda holding on to it with one arm.

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Re: How to get out with full on-shore winds

Postby Peter_Frank » Tue May 25, 2021 9:42 pm

bkkite wrote:
Tue May 25, 2021 8:39 pm
Similar question to people above, what isn't working with body dragging? I've found that going upwind body dragging with a foil is way easier than with a twin tip. If the water is shallow, I just role the board on its side, and then find the sweet spot of where I need to lay on the board in order for it to not go too far up wind, since the foil wants to push up (towards the wind).

It works well enough that I've done it not even laying on the board, just kinda holding on to it with one arm.

Exactly :thumb:
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Re: How to get out with full on-shore winds

Postby bragnouff » Tue May 25, 2021 11:22 pm

bkkite wrote:
Tue May 25, 2021 8:39 pm
what isn't working with body dragging? I've found that going upwind body dragging with a foil is way easier than with a twin tip.
It just gets more complicated when you have any kind of significant swell. That's the part that isn't straightforward. Even if it is much more efficient than body dragging with a twin-tip, you have to bodydrag for a much longer distance, until you reach chest deep water. And depending on the profile of your beach, that means you need to get through dozens of waves, each trying to destabilize you and push you back relentlessly, annihilating whatever little progress you had made in the previous 5mn.

Tenacity, observation and reactivity will lead to success eventually. But you will fail, eat shit, and repeat... It's a journey!

Had a bit of a struggle like that in Venice Beach 4 yrs ago, always caught a set on the head at the wrong time, killing my slow progress, and pushing me in the corner of Marina del Rey, so I had to exit the beach, walk back up, and try again. At my 3rd attempt, as I was waiting in the shallows for a lull in the waves, I got stung in the heel by what I suspect was a small stingray... I still tried and managed to make my way at the back this time, started to ride a few tacks up and down the beach, maybe like 10mn of bliss until the venom properly kicked in and pain reached the not-fun-anymore kind of threshold... Game over, packed, spent a couple of hours with foot in super hot water to reduce pain, and made it just in time for my 12hrs flight back home... Probably my worst foiling session. But as they say... No pain, no gain!

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Re: How to get out with full on-shore winds

Postby Trent hink » Tue May 25, 2021 11:55 pm

I usually lay on my foil board, superman fashion, and try to angle the wing for the best velocity out, and then try to duck under breaking waves. A smallish board will make this easier.

I still have trouble getting out sometimes.

One obvious solution I've found is to go out overpowered, and while this can work, It might not be optimal for having fun once you actually get out.

Then again, depending on the current, sometimes what feels like way overpowered on the beach is perfect once I get out.

In some spots, if you can find a rip-current, that's the best spot to try; waves will be breaking smaller in the rip-current and the current will help carry you out.


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