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Gong foils: discussion

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Flyboy
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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby Flyboy » Thu Jul 28, 2022 3:36 pm

Atte wrote:
Thu Jul 28, 2022 4:50 am
Flyboy wrote:
Wed Jul 27, 2022 10:29 pm
and there doesn't seem to be any way to contact Gong by Email to find out. Any suggestions?
https://www.gong-galaxy.com/en/help-contact/
This is what appears on their "help-contact" page:

WE CAN BE REACHED:
NOT CURRENTLY AVAILABLE

Additionally, for some unknown reason, I have never been able to successfully log in to their forum. :-?

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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby AndersP » Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:02 pm

When can we expect a new one piece carbon pro mast/fuselage from gong?

That would be a good thing for performance and travelling.

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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby Flyboy » Sat Jul 30, 2022 5:11 pm

The second part of my foil - the wing and stabilizer - arrived yesterday. It had been held up by the broker/shipper because they had not received payment of the taxes owing ... but they didn't notify me to ask for the payment and I didn't even have a tracking number to identify the shipment. So, in the end, Going comes through with a great product at a great price and delivered in a timely way, but the communication/customer service remains frustratingly inaccessible.

Now I have the 85cm carbon mono bloc, Curve M wing & fast stab ... and the 100cm mono bloc, Fluid MT & Fluid 40cm stab. I'm thinking I may try switching one component at a time to properly feel the difference each one makes - maybe start with the Fluid MT from wing on the 85cm with the Fast stab. I think Azoele commented that it took him a while to accept the Fluid stab in place of the Fast stab. Why would that be? How different in feeling is it?

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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby AndersP » Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:09 pm

I have the Fluid mt and used it with fast stab 45.
I felt that the fast stab 45 gave to much downforce at speed. I changed it to fast stab 40 and it was much better.
(The all black fast stab is also really cheap if it's still available)
Still just a little bit frontfoot pressure at high speed but very close to neutral.

With the Curve wing, the fast stab 45 felt ok, but I don't use the Curve much since the Fluid mt feels better at everything except the super easy, almost step up starts with the Curve m. Up on foils with one downstroke.

For me the Fluid mt needs some surface speed before take off. Usually a backloop is enough to get up on the foils except in underpowered conditions.
Up on foils it glides way better than than the curve and carve turns really good too.

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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby Flyboy » Sat Jul 30, 2022 11:00 pm

AndersP wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:09 pm
I have the Fluid mt and used it with fast stab 45.
I felt that the fast stab 45 gave to much downforce at speed. I changed it to fast stab 40 and it was much better.
(The all black fast stab is also really cheap if it's still available)
Still just a little bit frontfoot pressure at high speed but very close to neutral.

With the Curve wing, the fast stab 45 felt ok, but I don't use the Curve much since the Fluid mt feels better at everything except the super easy, almost step up starts with the Curve m. Up on foils with one downstroke.

For me the Fluid mt needs some surface speed before take off. Usually a backloop is enough to get up on the foils except in underpowered conditions.
Up on foils it glides way better than than the curve and carve turns really good too.
I have the 40 cm Fast stab. Seems (& looks) like it should be very neutral in lift. The Fluid 40cm stab looks like it should be somewhat similar, as it has a pretty flat profile, although the wing sits at the top of the fuselage connection other than the middle like the Fast. In any case, I'm going to start with the Fluid MT & the familiar Fast stab just to try and focus on how the Fluid wing feels different from the Curve.

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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby Zamed » Sun Jul 31, 2022 4:29 pm

AndersP wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:02 pm
When can we expect a new one piece carbon pro mast/fuselage from gong?

That would be a good thing for performance and travelling.
Gong never share information about their future products.
Monoblock carbon mast with short fuse, to acomodate the HA stabs, would be a natural development.
I hope that Gong will surprise us with this somewhere in 2023.

I share your feelings about Fluid vs. Curve.
My first set: Alu mast 95 + Curve MT front wing + Curve 39 stab
My second set: Carbon monoblock 100 + Fluid M front wing + fluid 40 stab
The first set I prefer when the surf is up and the sea is rough, since it's more stable and I can go slower so I don't outrun the waves.
The second set is my favorite for all normal conditions as it's much more "alive" , faster and glides better. Much nicer on fast curves and all upwind manuvers.

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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby Flyboy » Sun Jul 31, 2022 8:14 pm

Zamed wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 4:29 pm
I share your feelings about Fluid vs. Curve.
My first set: Alu mast 95 + Curve MT front wing + Curve 39 stab
My second set: Carbon monoblock 100 + Fluid M front wing + fluid 40 stab
The first set I prefer when the surf is up and the sea is rough, since it's more stable and I can go slower so I don't outrun the waves.
The second set is my favorite for all normal conditions as it's much more "alive" , faster and glides better. Much nicer on fast curves and all upwind manuvers.
I also first had the alu mast with a Curve (M) wing & the Curve 39 stab. I sold that & switched to the 85cm mono bloc mast with Curve M wing and 40cm Fast stab. The Fast stab was very noticeably different from the Curve stab - faster, smoother, less draggy, but a little less stable feeling. Now I just received the 100 cm mono bloc with Fluid MT & Fluid 40cm stab. I hope to get it on the water tomorrow. I was not in a hurry to change from the Curve M wing as I have become very dialled in on it, but I can see that the Curve wing has a draggy quality to it that probably inhibits straight-line speed and glide in turns. It seems to me that the Fluid should allow faster riding upwind & nicer gliding turns in lower wind/lower swell conditions.

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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby azoele » Mon Aug 01, 2022 11:45 am

Hi, yes, I started to like the Fluid 40 so much I ended up selling the Fast 40.

The key difference between the two:
– Fast 40 is "fast", and very loose. The feel is skatey, very easy on jibes, and needing abdominal/hip work during duck tacks. I very much liked it.

– Fluid 40 is fast too, but at first I did not like it because I had a feeling of "needing to push hard" to tilt it on the sides and turn.
The Fast just seems to be willing to allow you change the board inclination at will, with very little input. The Fluid not so much.

Why I kept the Fluid?
Because eventually I learned not to be importuned by the extra effort to turn, and started loving, but loving the "carving like on rails" feeling of the fluid.
Especially when duck tacking, or when toeside-tacking, you tilt it, and there it turns like a train on rails!
It is so much fun to tilt it going toeside, and do a easy tack or complete a 360°and coming out again in toeside, a loop and yet another run, this time "just" a toeside tack and you have switched direction.
It is super, super fun for this.
When duck tacking I love to pick up speed, and then incline the body just a bit with a very tight tack preserving significant speed just by a slight inclination backwards of the body.

The Fluid will keep turning assuredly like it's going on the road instead of the water, and I have now absolutely zero problem carving with it. (I use a Fluid L-s).

So, the GONG 100 (the latest carbon, with the alu fuselage, which is even stiffer than the old v.2 monoblock) + Fluid L-s + Fluid 40 (and maybe a Fluid-h 38 when they become available: this is my "relaxing" setup for when I want to play around, try to foil on a single leg, explore ultra light winds, or wish for a super easy setup, where to finally test the roll-tack (my bete noir!). :thumb:
It's an amazing, but amazing setup when you factor performance, price, flight characteristics, and the exquisite balance of stability/agility.

For the rest, I switched to the T1 monofoil by Triton... which is something completely else, and dangerously addictive for anyone who loves carving :roll: :D

I'm sure with a lighter weight the Fluid M-t would be a blast.
Although a 97Kg friend rides the Fluid M with great pleasure too, so if you're 70 or 80Kgs, I'd probably go to the M for its bit of extra liveliness without loosing much low end if at all.


Flyboy wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 5:11 pm
The second part of my foil - the wing and stabilizer - arrived yesterday. It had been held up by the broker/shipper because they had not received payment of the taxes owing ... but they didn't notify me to ask for the payment and I didn't even have a tracking number to identify the shipment. So, in the end, Going comes through with a great product at a great price and delivered in a timely way, but the communication/customer service remains frustratingly inaccessible.

Now I have the 85cm carbon mono bloc, Curve M wing & fast stab ... and the 100cm mono bloc, Fluid MT & Fluid 40cm stab. I'm thinking I may try switching one component at a time to properly feel the difference each one makes - maybe start with the Fluid MT from wing on the 85cm with the Fast stab. I think Azoele commented that it took him a while to accept the Fluid stab in place of the Fast stab. Why would that be? How different in feeling is it?

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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby azoele » Mon Aug 01, 2022 11:56 am

Zamed wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 4:29 pm
AndersP wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 3:02 pm
When can we expect a new one piece carbon pro mast/fuselage from gong?

That would be a good thing for performance and travelling.
Gong never share information about their future products.
Monoblock carbon mast with short fuse, to acomodate the HA stabs, would be a natural development.
I hope that Gong will surprise us with this somewhere in 2023.

I do not think so: making yet another mast would make zero sense for them.

The latest carbon masts are different shapes, profiles and thickness than the latest monoblocks, and I assure you that they are both heavier and stiffer.
They are by all means better and more performing products, and the new fuselages (Alu and Titanium) allow a reduction in drag with the new -H stabilizers which gives the whole setup a needed kick in speed, with the extra of a little reduction in weight.
(all the locals who test the GONG and are good foilers like them, but find them much slower in instant acceleration and higher speeds than the Sabfoils like the Onda or the 699, so drag reduction probably was high on their list, especially thinking of the wing useage).

Also, GONG's kite line is an "afterthought". The whole investment is on Winging, which is still exploding apparently, and has a specific set of needs very different from kitefoil.
They gave us some "new" wings (like the Curve Xs, and the Fluid and Veloce Xs), but compared to the brand new -H line of front wings (wing only, clearly) that is not so much.

Whatever. I keep recommending the basic setups to every beginner.
In my opinion, the kit Carbon Board + Alu v.2 85cm + X-over setup is just magical to begin.
And then you have access to loads of materials to progress in any direction :thumb:
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Re: Gong foils: discussion

Postby ieism » Mon Aug 01, 2022 12:41 pm

azoele wrote:
Mon Aug 01, 2022 11:56 am
[



Whatever. I keep recommending the basic setups to every beginner.
In my opinion, the kit Carbon Board + Alu v.2 85cm + X-over setup is just magical to begin.
And then you have access to loads of materials to progress in any direction :thumb:
I had that exact setup and now changed to Curve and Carbon V2 mast. For sure the X-over is easier for a beginner and the way to go at that price. I also have the new pro stab on the way even though I'm not sure I'll like it more than my current one. A bit lighter weight is always nice I guess.


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