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hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

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bitxopalo
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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby bitxopalo » Tue May 17, 2022 11:44 pm

Have tried again yesterday .
I was with my low volume board and peak 5m, on a very caotic wind before a storm.

The kite ended on the water so I packed and tried to swim (it was no more than 50m)... I am unable to do it, cannot swim with the kite in between board and me. Tried everything.

So, is there a video where I can see how it must be done? :?:

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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby martrench » Tue May 17, 2022 11:54 pm

This kind of fits this thread -- I had a chance to try a big wing foiling front wing with my kiteboard in low winds yesterday.

There was just enough wind for my 10m Soul V2 to launch and I had to keep kite moving overhead on the beach.

A 25L 4' 6" Slingshot Dwarfcraft, Axis 1150 Pump & Glide wing (1778 cm2) and 400mm freeride rear, short fuselage and 90 cm mast.

Getting up on foil was really easy and it was surprisingly fun.

I could go crazy slow and just glide with a tiny amount of kite power and then I tried working the kite to get in some faster runs. Turns were not very tight! Like a bus :D

I want to try it again with my faster flying 6m Peak 5. Not sure if having a bigger Wing board would have helped much...
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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby bragnouff » Wed May 18, 2022 1:57 am

bitxopalo wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 11:44 pm
Have tried again yesterday .
I was with my low volume board and peak 5m, on a very caotic wind before a storm.

The kite ended on the water so I packed and tried to swim (it was no more than 50m)... I am unable to do it, cannot swim with the kite in between board and me. Tried everything.

So, is there a video where I can see how it must be done? :?:
I only did the swim of shame once with my 5m Peak, definitely not an experienced self-rescuer-swimmer! But yeah, the goal was to roll the lines all the way to the kite, then make a small pack around the bar and tucking in all stray bridles. Then put that package lengthwise under the tummy/chest on the board, and start paddling in. That wasn't a super fast progress, but that was progress nonetheless. Note that I'm using a 36L 4'8 Zeeko Scrambler, which is a prone foil board, so kind of designed for paddling. Lower volume and shorter would both reduce any paddling ability. That board is my "contingency plan" for riding the Peaks.
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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby bitxopalo » Wed May 18, 2022 9:46 pm

Impresed with this proyect.
It fills more objetives than sail in lightwind.

Take a look :
https://lonekiter.com/kite-trek-project/
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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby Peter_Frank » Wed Aug 17, 2022 6:39 pm

martrench wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 11:54 pm
This kind of fits this thread -- I had a chance to try a big wing foiling front wing with my kiteboard in low winds yesterday.

There was just enough wind for my 10m Soul V2 to launch and I had to keep kite moving overhead on the beach.

A 25L 4' 6" Slingshot Dwarfcraft, Axis 1150 Pump & Glide wing (1778 cm2) and 400mm freeride rear, short fuselage and 90 cm mast.

Getting up on foil was really easy and it was surprisingly fun.

I could go crazy slow and just glide with a tiny amount of kite power and then I tried working the kite to get in some faster runs. Turns were not very tight! Like a bus :D

I want to try it again with my faster flying 6m Peak 5. Not sure if having a bigger Wing board would have helped much...

Did you ever get to try with a Peak 6 m2?

It has good powerspike for its size, so the most interesting size, especially if wingfoilers need something to be able to "foil" on low wind days.
And how much do you weigh?

Average weights like me need 9 knots to kitefoil on a small board with a 6 m2.

How low can you go using a kite like that (or similar) allowing you to kitefoil on small boards in 9 knots, if you "climb" up on a +5 or +10 liter wingfoilboard with say a big 1500 cm2 foilwing? (bigger arent used anymore nowadays, in fact often sub 1000 cm2)

8 or 11 or 13 m2 Peak kites might go lower, but will also be super big and slow turning - it could be interesting to see how low you can go with the excellent 6 m2 size - has anyone tried?

Maybe it does not give much difference, so instead of 9 knots you can ride in 8 now?
Or?

8) Peter

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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby Smeagle » Sun Oct 30, 2022 4:44 pm

Just found this thread, nice.

I'm doing experiments with Kite & WingFoil-Board, too.

I'm surprised you seem to use "small" boards and Foils?

I bought largest Board and Foil I could get ;) OK, I am a beginner in KiteFoil and never did WingFoil before, I plan on learning Wingfoiling, too - but so far I only tried it with kite ;)

I was using the Peak4 13m for a while now with Kitefoil-Equipment (Gong Curve MT / Catch 4'8" 37l ).

The problem was not the riding, as soon as I got up in a gust and am Foiling, I can keep foiling in 3..5 knots, really no problem. But I needed 7..8 knot to get going.

The big problem was most of the time when I have 3..5 knots I don't have any gusts at all. And it was impossible for me to get onto the board/foil in that wind.

So I got a Gong X-Over XXL + Gong 6'6" HIPE Start.

The idea was, to choose a board big enough, to climb up and stand up on even when static. I learned quickly, that doesn't work 100%, because when the board is not moving forward, it cannot keep tension in lines. So I need to build some forward speed very quick - I get on my knees, get some speed forward and THEN I stand up. And I am flying really quick after that. Using GPS Watch, I can see I can fly in ~7..9 km/h forward speed and a few seconds later I am stable at arround 17..20km/h. Even in VERY low wind.

I'm still learning. Biggest problem I have is getting CONTROL after getting up on foil. Part of this is I am not used to strapless...

Right now I am in the process of buying a Hysper-2 14m, as right now every drop of the kite means, I have to swim back to shore...




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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby Regis-de-giens » Sun Oct 30, 2022 6:57 pm

Nice video.
A big interest of single skin for this exercise is that they are so stable that you can let the bar go even in 4-5. Knots, the time you need to climb on the board.

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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby Smeagle » Mon Oct 31, 2022 2:18 pm

Yes, very important!

I have a 18m F-One Diablo, too. I use it mostly on land with Buggy, in VERY low wind... Also I used it with TwinTip on water a lot, but now that I switched to KiteFoil I don't need it on water, in those conditions I now go with 12m Hawk and foil instead. I think, in the future I might be able to KiteFoil with race kites, but for now I am not good enough to keep line tension at all times.

Especially with KiteFoil or WingFoil I don't like it... I do these low wind session at a very small lake, close to home. Short sessions after work etc. - There is no space... Lot's of trees, etc, you can see in video a little.

I can handle the single skin very easy in these conditions, fly arround trees etc., but I can't controll the race kite good enough for that. Race Kite needs to be moved at all time and never loose tension, while I can control the single skin at slow speed.

I can't even climb on the board with a race kite, I need the exceptional great drift of single skin to do that... There are several LONG seconds of NO TENSION AT ALL while climbing on the board, getting on the knees, until finally the board starts to move and line tension is there again... I can't keep the Race Kite flying in these conditions, I tried.

Maybe with a lot more practice?

For now, I stay with Single Skin, next step after Peak4 the Hysper Hybrid... Maybe one day when I am better I will be able to ride race kite in 3 knots... ;)

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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby a99 » Mon Oct 31, 2022 3:11 pm

i think most sufficient start in super low winds is to use Pump foil wings (as Sab w1350), use small 1-1.3m board, use peak 6 -5 meters for fast loops. Technic can be easy - jump on board with pump wing already with Peak 6 or 5m in the air. Or use ladder to start if no doc exist. With such setup you will have best option - possibility to pump easy and create apparent wind for Peak to stay in the air even at 2-3 knots, if you don't want to pump all time can use Peak with loops to generate speed in any way. Why nobody tried this setup?

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Re: hybrid discipline: "Kite-Big-Foil" = wingfoil pulled by kite

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Oct 31, 2022 8:22 pm

Hmmm, I dont think we are talking about the same in this thread...

It is about riding a wingfoil in winds where there is no chance for starting on a smaller board.

Thus you need a board sufficient size to "climb" aboard without any kitepull.
And from there, with the right foilwing, able to get flying with a superlight kite that can hang in this ridiculous low wind.

A sport of its own, but very interesting for so many reasons.

Regarding the pack down, SO much easier on these boards, as you can sit comfortably and just roll the lines up, and drain the water while packing the kite down - and eventually paddle ashore, and maybe relaunch and dry in the air before you go for another ride :thumb:

I wouldnt have a chance of going on a 1-1.3 meter board in this wind :wink:
Maybe many of you can pump such a foilboard without any kite to pull - I cant :x
And for sure not get up standing without kitepull...

8) Peter
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