Moved from SAB/Moses Mast to Cedrus Mast

[taiguy]

I've now had a few weeks of time riding my new 90cm cedrus mast in both Hood River, OR and Sherman Island, CA. I'm using it with two different moses/sab setups. The first is the 695/647/421 and the second is the 799/710/370 - one big and one small. I'm riding a Kanaha Shapes 42" pocket foil board.











There is an immediately noticeable improvement with stiffness compared to the 101 moses mast I had been using previously. This additional stiffness is a huge benefit. I'm riding with the "heavy" collar and with the moses fuselage adapter attached it weighs in at 1964g. My wife has the same mast but with the lighter weight eccentric collar and it's 1738g. The 101cm moses mast weighs in at 2038g.

I don't notice (or at least care) about the additional thickness as much as I thought I might. It's noticeable but not meaningful to me given how much stiffer the mast is.

My only reservation about the mast is I have fairly consistent ventilation issues regardless of which wing setup I'm using or location. So long as you ride mostly flat, like most wing foilers, you probably won't notice it as much. As a kite foiler though, if I'm leaned over and accelerating, it feels like you hit an exploding bubble which causes loss of lift and you immediately get knocked over. Occasionally now I can compensate and correct my weighting before I fall. Other times you just eat it. It can happen while you are riding flat as well, you feel the bubble pop, but you regain lift before you crash into the water. It happens more frequently if I'm riding aggressively.

I emailed Kyle about it and he said he's had a few people mention it to him but a small minority. Others have fewer ventilation issues compared to the mast they used earlier. I think your best bet is to see if there's anyone with a mast around you and demo it with your setup to see if you have ventilation issues or not.

At this point I still think the additional stiffness is a bigger benefit than the ventilation issue.

They just announced aluminum masts using their fuselage adapters. I'm likely going to order one in 70cm for the shallow bay riding of places like South Padre Island, TX. Buying multiple short masts sounds terrible to me. Buying 1 short mast and then using it across multiple brands/setups sounds slightly less awful.

Finally, Cedrus doesn't offer an OEM mast cover for sale. I ended up sourcing one that works from Sailworks in Hood River, OR. I believe it's the 85cm cover which was a fit for my 90cm mast.

[geokite]

I have a similar setup; Kanaha 37", 90cm Cedrus, lift wings. Got the Cedrus last fall, no problems, but this season I've had the ventilation issue when driving hard. It can be quite a wipeout. I thought it was something about the place I ride, as there is sea grass that can be floating in the water and fish. You think it is the mast? Hmm.

Do you have a direct link for that cover? I couldn't find it on Sailworks site.

[rnelias]

can this ventilation issue be related to the different materials used in the mast? I mean... there's a ruberized material on the trailing and leading edge right? How is the finish in the junction of the ruberized and mast's core?

[Frankieboy]

No ventilation for me with KS 37'', 90cm mast (93 with adapter) and SAB (kite & wing)
I had a M82 before and they wheight approx the same. The M92 was much too heavy for my liking.
I am a heavy dude and the extra stiffness is really a plus winging.
Great stuff

[taiguy]

I have a similar setup; Kanaha 37", 90cm Cedrus, lift wings. Got the Cedrus last fall, no problems, but this season I've had the ventilation issue when driving hard. It can be quite a wipeout. I thought it was something about the place I ride, as there is sea grass that can be floating in the water and fish. You think it is the mast? Hmm.

Do you have a direct link for that cover? I couldn't find it on Sailworks site.

The mast is the only common factor when I've tested it across different wings. I never used to have ventilation issues like this with the OEM moses masts. When ventilation occurs, it feels like your feet/wing got knocked out from under you. For small instances, I've actually been able to to correct and ride the adrenaline spike a bit. For large instances, it'll just collapse under you

You have to call Sailworks. Their website is only so-so.

[BayAreaKite]

Hey @taiguy thanks for the great photos and overall positive feedback. Ventilation is extremely complex and I wanted to get all my thoughts in one place to help clarify exactly what it is and the most likely causes. Please check out my blog if you want to learn more: https://projectcedrus.com/cedrus-develo ... ntilation/

Thanks, Kyle

[jakemoore]

I've had an older carbon mast (different brand) develop ventilation problems with surface roughness. The problem was fixed with a very light wet sanding. There is a way to test the surface of a foil by pouring water over it and trying to visualize the wetting angle. I wish I could find the video. Ideally the water should sheet out over the surface. Waxy surfaces and oily fingerprints that bead water are more likely to ventilate.

I wonder about sanding the Cedrus mast should the need arise considering its 3 piece construction. I"ve had no ventilation at all but am using the original Cedrus mast to ride mellow big wings especially with wing-surf.

[grigorib]

Knowing that aluminum adapter will not have occasional “insert pull” issues of carbon masts, it seems to be a great alternative to Kraken

[taiguy]

Knowing that aluminum adapter will not have occasional “insert pull” issues of carbon masts, it seems to be a great alternative to Kraken

Hey Grigori! I've been using 20mm high strength socket screws (https://www.mcmaster.com/catalog/128/3427). I always disassemble each day for transport. After coming back in on my kite fuselage yesterday I noticed my front fuselage screw had a small sliver of aluminum attached to it. It easily popped out of the thread, but now I wonder if there's a small sliver missing from the adapter. In any case, I have a set of 25mm high strength socket screws coming from mcmaster later this week, with the intention of having more thread engagement in the adapter. Also nice to know that the adapter pieces themselves can be easily replaced if needed.

[taiguy]

I've had an older carbon mast (different brand) develop ventilation problems with surface roughness. The problem was fixed with a very light wet sanding. There is a way to test the surface of a foil by pouring water over it and trying to visualize the wetting angle. I wish I could find the video. Ideally the water should sheet out over the surface. Waxy surfaces and oily fingerprints that bead water are more likely to ventilate.

I wonder about sanding the Cedrus mast should the need arise considering its 3 piece construction. I"ve had no ventilation at all but am using the original Cedrus mast to ride mellow big wings especially with wing-surf.

Interesting - I've noticed oily fingerprints on my mast. I'll give it a good wipedown with rubbing alcohol before taking it out again.