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Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby Peter_Frank » Sat Feb 10, 2024 10:29 am

watercamper wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2024 2:32 pm
The Take Off speed of the 669 is 16 -18 kn. It will be interesting to try it. Can't wait for @lifeinthehood to return to LV. I haven't looked at it's attachment. Are u guys saying it won't fit on my 647 fuse? How abt my surf fuse? What stab is recommended? 330? The 769 has a lower take off speed and might be more user friendly?

Is that the listed stallspeed by Sabfoil?

If so, one needs to know if it is average weights and without a kite (which I believe it must be, everything else wouldnt make sense).

When using a kite, a fixed stall speed is only the basic reference, as the more power you have in your kite, the lower you can go.
Have ridden on big surf foil at super low speed, and talking to my friends on superthin small racefoils - and they can actually reduce the stall speed close to zero speed, by having sufficient kitepull up.
Quite astonashing in fact - so the more power you have in your kite, the slower you can foil.

It is all about wing loading (foil loading), nothing but that :D

Okay, of course less experienced will have a higher stall speed, as keeping the AOA totally consistent is key to absolute minimum stall speed - but those in this thread are experienced :rollgrin:

8) Peter
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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby lifeinthehood » Sat Feb 10, 2024 5:26 pm

They list it exactly as @watercamper wrote - Take Off Speed. I don’t think this is stall speed. The 799 Take Off Speed is listed as 13-15 knots. I learned on that wing and there is no way the stall speed is 13-15 knots. I was able to foil at well under 10 knots just fine. My best guess is that’s the speed required to get it to lift off the water surface which may require a bit more power than to stay on foil and not stall.

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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby nixmatters » Sat Feb 10, 2024 8:40 pm

+1
There is no way these kn take off speeds are nautical miles speed of the foiler!

Back in the days when I learned foiling at the cable park, I was casually foiling with the Zeeko Blaster (Carver 710 below) at 19kmh (10knots) and was able to take off with the Freeride (535cm²) at about 20kmh.
Towing - no vertical lift from a kite or wing.

16-18 kn = 30-33kmh :o
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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby taiguy » Thu Feb 15, 2024 5:00 pm

I've been riding a 695/421 combo as my main setup for the past few years and have been a fan. I'm 110 kg and use a 5m UFO in 20+ and a 7m UFO in 14-20. One of the aspects I like about the 695/421 setup is the very neutral weight distribution between front and rear leg. I picked up the 769 after lifeinthehood came down to La Ventana this winter and told me about it.

I initially tried it with the 370 stabilizer, but found the front foot pressure a bit higher than I prefer. There is also a bit less yaw and roll stability given the flat profile. I switched to the 421 stabilizer, and was surprised to find out it has less lift than the 370 and evened out the weight distribution. Still plenty of maneuverability but with a more consistent pitch control.

Image

Image

Image

Despite being 70cm2 smaller than the 695, the 769 has plenty of lift once it gets moving. The ride of the 769 feels similar to the 695 (which is what I was looking for) but it can definitely go faster. It doesn't chatter as much as you push it at the higher speeds. I think the stall behavior is a little more abrupt than the 695 and you need to keep well powered otherwise it will drop you. It doesn't seem to recover well from ventilation either.

Overall not upset with the purchase. I'm looking forward to trying it with a smaller stabilizer, maybe the 399 or the new 375.
Last edited by taiguy on Thu Feb 15, 2024 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby a99 » Thu Feb 15, 2024 5:34 pm

taiguy wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 5:00 pm
I've been riding a 695/421 combo as my main setup for the past few years and have been a fan. I'm 110 kg and use a 5m UFO in 20+ and a 7m UFO in 14-20. One of the aspects I like about the 695/421 setup is the very neutral weight distribution between front and rear leg. I picked up the 769 after lifeinthehood came down to La Ventana this winter and told me about it.
I initially tried it with the 370 stabilizer, but found the front foot pressure a bit higher than I prefer. There is also a bit less yaw and roll stability given the flat profile. I switched to the 421 stabilizer, and was surprised to find out it has less lift than the 370 and evened out the weight distribution. Still plenty of maneuverability but with a more consistent pitch control.

Despite being 70cm2 smaller than the 695, the 769 has plenty of lift once it gets moving. The ride of the 769 feels similar to the 695 (which is what I was looking for) but it can definitely go faster. It doesn't chatter as much as you push it at the higher speeds. I think the stall behavior is a little more abrupt than the 695 and you need to keep well powered otherwise it will drop you. It doesn't seem to recover well from ventilation either.
Overall not upset with the purchase. I'm looking forward to trying it with a smaller stabilizer, maybe the 399 or new 375.
Thanks for review. Try old 425 stab, it is best of best stab, of course it is difficult to find for buy.
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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby Peter_Frank » Thu Feb 15, 2024 6:34 pm

Hi taiguy - your 421 (bigger) stab having less front foot pressure than your 370, indicates an AOA difference.

The 421 is 221 cm2, the 370 is 195 cm2, so if AOA alignment compared to profile zero lift was equal, the 370 would have LESS front foot pressure.

As far as I can see one can shim the Sabfoil stab?

I would use the 370 and shim it to give the desired pressure, thus a more lively fun stab :naughty:

8) Peter

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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby lifeinthehood » Thu Feb 15, 2024 8:58 pm

Peter_Frank wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 6:34 pm
Hi taiguy - your 421 (bigger) stab having less front foot pressure than your 370, indicates an AOA difference.

The 421 is 221 cm2, the 370 is 195 cm2, so if AOA alignment compared to profile zero lift was equal, the 370 would have LESS front foot pressure.
I'm not sure it's adequate to compare just surface area specs. Especially since the 370 is flat and the 421 has winglets. The effective surface area - the area that provides the downward pressure (and thus the greater front foot pressure @taiguy felt) - might actually be less on the 421 if you subtract out the winglet surface area. In addition, I believe the 421 is also thinner and has a shorter chord (61.7mm vs 67mm).

But you might have a point about the difference in AOA. I recall that one of the complaints of the 450 was that its "native" AOA was too negative resulting in more front foot pressure than most people liked. Since the 421 was designed as a race stab, and the 370 as a surf stab, they may have different AOA's designed into their profile.

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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby lifeinthehood » Thu Feb 15, 2024 9:17 pm

taiguy wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 5:00 pm
Overall not upset with the purchase. I'm looking forward to trying it with a smaller stabilizer, maybe the 399 or the new 375.
We are terrible for each other's wallets. :rollgrin:
Also, it must be said - the Medusa Pros are simply beautiful looking foils. :D

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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby taiguy » Thu Feb 15, 2024 9:43 pm

Peter_Frank wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2024 6:34 pm
Hi taiguy - your 421 (bigger) stab having less front foot pressure than your 370, indicates an AOA difference.

The 421 is 221 cm2, the 370 is 195 cm2, so if AOA alignment compared to profile zero lift was equal, the 370 would have LESS front foot pressure.

As far as I can see one can shim the Sabfoil stab?

I would use the 370 and shim it to give the desired pressure, thus a more lively fun stab :naughty:

8) Peter
I'll print up some shims when I get back from La Ventana and will add them to the kit!

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Re: Sabfoil released Medusa Pro wings 699, 769, 869

Postby Peter_Frank » Thu Feb 15, 2024 9:54 pm

True - if tips are "up or down" the area is not that different maybe.

But it is still wrong that one lifts more than the other then, as profile and thickness doesnt matter - they are still not in tune regarding lift AOA if roughly same area.

So shims is my advice taiguy :thumb:

8) Peter


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