Flysurfer Sonic Race vs VMG

[sonny2727]

Hi All,
I'm looking at used race kites and now these kites are cheap as VMG2 is out. But not sure what are the differences between Race and VMG? Looks like both got x-light fabric and 3 level briday from about 2018 and may be good for freeriding as x-light supposed to be durable? No, I don't race and I cannot afford new Sonic3 (lucky to have a job these days!) so looking at cheaper options. I do have a Soul but upwind is not the best and I hardly use relaunch so perhaps other alternatives are available.
thanks

[airsail]

I was in exactly the same position, wondering if a used race kite was a good freeride option. After much research and asking questions I came to the conclusion that used race kites are best avoided even though they are relatively cheap.
I opted for a used FS Sonic 2, I like the Flysurfer product, it has an adjustable mixer, readily available bridle parts, full line plan and well made with quality materials. It cost no more than a used race kite and seems to be very user friendly.
Would love a Sonic 3 but in these times I’m playing it safe.
I did own a Pansh at one stage, but I won’t go down that road again.

[pmaggie]

Sonic 3 actually IS a fantastic freeride kite, once you understand it's quite racey (non comparable to the classic sheet in and go pump). Never tested a Sonic 2, but if you are freeriding only and looking for a good used kite consider also a Soul.

[cwood]

Sonic 2's are wonderful, stay away from 1's.

Race kites are not good for free ride...quickly nasty out of tune and just not durable. Exception is R1V2's which hold up better than Sonic Races or VMG's. VMG's being the worst of the bunch.

Confused at you saying you will hurt with Soul upwind....they perform quite favorably even next to high AR kites....look to your wing as the way to increase upwind performance.

[juanpasala]

Difference between Sonic Race and VMG is the bridle structure (vmg has less bridles), internal structure of the kite (VMG is stiffer), and aspect ratio (Sonic race is higher aspect ratio than the VMG).
All of this totals to a much more stable VMG, but as little bit more delicate due to the reduced bridles. However, none of those kites are suited for freeriding and will punish you heavily if you make any mistake.
Strange you feel soul is not good for going upwind, I ve both Soul and Sonic Race, and there is a difference of 5 degreees in the upwind angle between the both of them, but not to a point it will be noticeable, specially if you are not racing, and this is balanced by a much easier and deeper angles whilst going downind.

[Jyoder]

I don’t race but I like to kite fast on 550cm2 and 700cm2 hydrofoil with strapless pocket board. I’ve had an old Fone Diablo v1 11m for a couple years and still going strong. I love it and it’s plenty docile if you have the skills and experience. I learned to tack with this kite! I picked up a Flysurfer Race 15m for ultra light wind and I’ve gotten dialed in pretty well. It has its quirks but is perfectly suitable for job.

Don’t believe them when they say race kites can’t work for free ride.

[cwood]

Gad you are happy, but I have owned them all and if you put lots of sessions in, in less than perfect conditions you will have much more grief on race kites.

[sonny2727]

I guess not all race kites are similar when used. I have a R1V2 second hand and its holding up pretty well and so far no adjustments etc. Mainly using for Hydrofoil and TT, as when the wind picks up I'd switch to a TT and continue rather than putting up another kite. This is also the reason why upwind is more important compered to if I'd only hydrofoil. Re-Soul upwind, this may be purely psychological as I know the aspect rations and expect poor performance from Soul. Another thing I'd like to test is the boosting performance of some of the pure race kites compared to a soul. My 15M Soul boosts pretty well with my average skill, not much technique required just pull the bar and off you fly.

[cwood]

I guess not all race kites are similar when used. I have a R1V2 second hand and its holding up pretty well and so far no adjustments etc. Mainly using for Hydrofoil and TT, as when the wind picks up I'd switch to a TT and continue rather than putting up another kite. This is also the reason why upwind is more important compered to if I'd only hydrofoil. Re-Soul upwind, this may be purely psychological as I know the aspect rations and expect poor performance from Soul. Another thing I'd like to test is the boosting performance of some of the pure race kites compared to a soul. My 15M Soul boosts pretty well with my average skill, not much technique required just pull the bar and off you fly.

Yes the R1's are probably the most robust of the race variants... I don't consider Sonic 2 and 3 race kites in the pure sense and they are more robust as well.

With respect to boosting performance, this was mainly the reason we all went through race kite phases in our group. 10's of thousands of boosts and general results over the years would be Sonic2 = R1V2 = Soul. Sampling of Sonic Race and VMG never lasted long because they quickly became unreliable...although I did have good performance from a brand new Sonic Race 9m before I saw what was coming and got rid of it. Our highest boosters are on R1's and Souls. I suspect the Sonic 3 may be potentially a bit better but only time will tell. One of the reasons Souls are liked is the big wind range they can handle....you can ride at the upper end of the range of a size reasonably comfortably and really send them when you are good and ready.

[davesails7]

I've owned multiple Sonic FR, Sonic 2, R1V2, and VMG.

Sonic FR was touchy.

Sonic 2 was way more stable and easy to use. Also very durable. Would be great for freeride. I tried the Sonic 2 11m back to back with the Speed 5 12m. Sonic 2 had better performance and just as stable for me.

R1V2 is just as stable as Sonic 2. R1V2 is definitely faster for racing, but it's less durable, and doesn't pivot turn like the Sonic 2, so I'd pick Sonic 2 for freeride over R1V2.

VMG is a racing machine. Seems less durable and has much less depower than the R1V2. I wouldn't recommend choosing it for freeride. You could use it, but it just doesn't seem like the advantages outweigh the negatives for free ride. I love it for racing.

I heard there were actually two versions of the sonic race. in 2018, they came out with different bridles because it continued as the IKA registered kite, and VMG was never registered. Does anyone know what difference the bridle change made for the Sonic Race?