For all foil kite riders
-
foilholio
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 3429
- Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:20 am
- Local Beach: Ventura Beach
- Favorite Beaches: Tarifa
- Style: Airstyle
- Gear: Foils
- Brand Affiliation: None
-
Has thanked:
227 times
-
Been thanked:
148 times
Postby foilholio » Wed Oct 23, 2019 7:53 pm
Sorry but not wrong at all. You are exhibiting what is common to feel some greater scientific knowledge in ignorance or maybe blindness to common facts, like is surrounding climate change. If the viscosity of air was greater than water you would be having a horrible time moving around. Have you tried walking in a pool? What you're stating is viscosity of air vs water based on mass, with volume then air is about 2 orders of magnitude less viscose than water.
I am not sure why water can not pass when air can, something to do with pressure and molecular forces. One example of a material that does this is Goretex.
Trust me you make a kite airtight not only will water not enter, but it will hold it's shape for longer and so relaunch will be much easier because of both effects.
-
flying grandpa
- Medium Poster
- Posts: 199
- Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2014 10:02 am
- Local Beach: Siemiany,
- Favorite Beaches: Stegna, Orle, Karwia
- Style: hydrofoil long distance, slalom, waves
- Gear: ZEEKO, Takuma, Sonic, Kestrel
- Brand Affiliation: NONE
- Location: Poland
-
Has thanked:
15 times
-
Been thanked:
14 times
Postby flying grandpa » Wed Oct 23, 2019 11:38 pm
foilholio wrote: ↑Wed Oct 23, 2019 7:53 pm
Sorry but not wrong at all. You are exhibiting what is common to feel some greater scientific knowledge in ignorance or maybe blindness to common facts, like is surrounding climate change.
If the viscosity of air was greater than water you would be having a horrible time moving around. Have you tried walking in a pool? What you're stating is viscosity of air vs water based on mass, with volume then air is about 2 orders of magnitude less viscose than water.
I am not sure why water can not pass when air can, something to do with pressure and molecular forces. One example of a material that does this is Goretex.
...
Air dynamic viscosity is ca 50 times greater than water. You can move in a pool and even easier in air due to 800 lower air density. 800/50=16 times easier.
IMHO goretex creates high water surface tension and that prevents water entrance. If you wash out impregnation, gortex no longer stay waterproof.
As a farmer I stay as close in touch with nature as you as a surfer.
Good sessions for you.
Tadeusz
-
nixmatters
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 963
- Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:38 pm
- Kiting since: 2009
- Style: freeride. started foiling, not there yet
- Gear: mostly custom made
- Brand Affiliation: None currently
-
Has thanked:
363 times
-
Been thanked:
246 times
Postby nixmatters » Thu Oct 24, 2019 4:53 am
Shall we please leave science aside and speak in kite relevant terms?
It's about air permeability and water repellency/absorption.
Most of the textile wash in or spray chemistry will do the job. Wash in formulas will likely have less weight than sprays.
P.S. browsing few of these tipics I run into my own comment of mine and need to add that most of the above mentioned textile chemistry will provide water repellency, but not affect the air permeability much
Last edited by
nixmatters on Wed Jan 15, 2020 2:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
foilholio
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 3429
- Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:20 am
- Local Beach: Ventura Beach
- Favorite Beaches: Tarifa
- Style: Airstyle
- Gear: Foils
- Brand Affiliation: None
-
Has thanked:
227 times
-
Been thanked:
148 times
Postby foilholio » Thu Oct 24, 2019 6:47 am
One measure of viscosity detached from practically says water is thinner than air. It's like saying ice is thinner than melted butter. I am not sure of the usefulness without adding density to the equation.
From what I was reading goretex is a membrane with small holes. I would have thought water was repelled because of molecule size but water is one of the smallest molecules, smaller than most gases. I would guess the inter molecular forces are what surface tension is, causing the water to clump together and so not pass through holes it otherwise could. I guess under sufficient pressure those forces are overcome and water is passed through. Which would explain why waterproof things doing like watersports.
My advice and experience is chasing waterproofing is of little benefit compared to air tightness, and the nikwax etc wash stuff does not last and is really for waterproofing.
-
wickedwim
- Rare Poster
- Posts: 12
- Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2015 11:07 am
- Gear: Ozone, north
- Brand Affiliation: None
-
Has thanked:
0
-
Been thanked:
0
Postby wickedwim » Thu Oct 24, 2019 10:13 am
Since 4 years I use Ultramar kite refit coating. Every year I wash my kites with rainwater ( I heard tap water has to much chlorine), and then use a spray pump to coat my kites.
Since I coat them the kites have a lot less wear and tear, dry way faster, easier to sell secondhand, etc.
It is not cheap but worth the money in my opinion.
-
JakeFarley
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 919
- Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2016 11:54 pm
- Kiting since: 2001
- Weight: 92kg
- Local Beach: Florida Left Coast, USA
- Favorite Beaches: Any that are not crowded.
- Style: Dinosaur style (Velociraptor)
- Gear: Kites: Flysurfer Speed5 21m, Soul 12m, Cabrinha 16m Xbow, 11m Xbow, Best 14m HP Nemesis, 9m Yarga C Hybrid
Boards: Crazyfly 135 x 46 Pro, Cabrinha Spoiler 140, 6' custom surfboard, 122 x 46 custom twintip
Wing foil: Naish Hover 110l, Slingwing 6.4m, F-One CWC Strike 8m, Slingshot Hover Glide Fwing (Infinity 99), Slingshot Phantasm 926 and E 990
- Brand Affiliation: None
- Location: Pearl City
-
Has thanked:
187 times
-
Been thanked:
144 times
Postby JakeFarley » Mon Mar 23, 2020 3:21 pm
How about the Dowsil 3140 RTV coating? Better flow/viscosity maybe?
https://www.dow.com/content/dcc/en-us/p ... 5788z.html
-
kiteykitekite
- Frequent Poster
- Posts: 271
- Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2020 10:41 pm
- Kiting since: 2020
- Gear: Core kites
- Brand Affiliation: None
-
Has thanked:
56 times
-
Been thanked:
32 times
Postby kiteykitekite » Wed Mar 25, 2020 2:29 am
Maybe. 3145 has better properties but 3140 may just be thinner 3145. Properties change after thinning. Though the SDSes are different but similar.
-
nixmatters
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 963
- Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:38 pm
- Kiting since: 2009
- Style: freeride. started foiling, not there yet
- Gear: mostly custom made
- Brand Affiliation: None currently
-
Has thanked:
363 times
-
Been thanked:
246 times
Postby nixmatters » Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:39 am
These silicone coatings cannot (or should not) be thinned. Most silicone adhesive systems are not solvent based. For best results you need a 2K system, the problem with which is that the platinum based cross linking gets blocked when in contact with PU - in case you would be recoating a LEI canopy. For foil kites originally finished with silicone coating they should work fine, but again the high viscosity of a 100% system would be an issue for recoating a kite.
-
Regis-de-giens
- Very Frequent Poster
- Posts: 2006
- Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:58 pm
- Weight: 62 kg
- Local Beach: France: St Laurent du Var, Cannes, Almanarre
- Style: 62 kg , light wind, waves
- Gear: Conceptair pulsion 18&15&12S, OR Flite 10m , Airush One 9&6, peak 5M , Rally 6, Elf 11 &7, 19m2 single skin proto.
foil Ketos, RCS Supreme, TBK Mana, snowskis, kite-boat
- Brand Affiliation: None
-
Has thanked:
266 times
-
Been thanked:
351 times
Postby Regis-de-giens » Fri Mar 27, 2020 2:54 am
Could a 2K rtv based on perroxite curing work better ?
When curring issues appear with platiniums,, it is an alternative.
But indeed, in microscopic thicknesses coatings, a solvent seems necessary.
Silicone is also quite heavy by the way (heavier than water ...)
Return to “Foil Kites”
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 168 guests