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pansh a15 in 9m

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Regis-de-giens
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Sat Feb 23, 2019 9:58 am

Yes and no ... it stays very stable is slack lines, good drift (better than FRS for example), however it needs some line tension to turn quick otherwise it turns too wide when going toward the kite (Frs is better at this but less stable)... so it will depend on your practice in waves (playing with moving suraface water ok, engaged surfing requiring rapid loop and change of window, not very good.

Any other point is ok with this forgiving and easy kite.

foilholio
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby foilholio » Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:24 pm

Thanks

If you wanted help to try my mods so far just let me know. It is a work in progress but I quite like the improvements so far.

Regis-de-giens
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Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:58 pm
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Local Beach: France: St Laurent du Var, Cannes, Almanarre
Style: 62 kg , light wind
Gear: Conceptair pulsion 15&12&.369 , Elf 11 &7, OR Flite 10m , Airush One 9&6, Rally 6&4.
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Thu Feb 28, 2019 9:57 pm

If you can kindly sum-up it here these mods that would be nice .
If i can find the time i will try.
Merci Foilholio

foilholio
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby foilholio » Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:27 pm

Sorry Regis I didn't see your post. I will do some measurements and try convert to 9m. I am liking the performance of my modded A15 heaps.

Meanwhile Jakemoore is selling his A15 9m Ultralight

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pansh-A15-ME-U ... 3784093811

Regis-de-giens
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Style: 62 kg , light wind
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Fri Apr 26, 2019 8:01 am

great ! thank you.

foilholio
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby foilholio » Fri Apr 26, 2019 4:53 pm

Ok disclaimer is this mod is still a work in progress, but I love it so far. My measurements could be slightly wrong or more,but I try. Replicating how I measure is important for reproducing the same. For extensions done as additional LCLs, that is from the knot to the top of the larkshead of the added lcl. All measurements were done on the kite assembled. I use as light a force to remove slack/droop as possible when measuring.

Most things can be changed using existing bridles, but some lighter line like 40-50kg will be needed for lcl extensions and kite line for mixer extensions/alterations.

I'll break it into parts and try be brief, as I can explain more if you want.

1. Remove all C bridles.

2. Convert mixer to 3:1.

3. Move 4 B bridles at tip to C position. Add lcl loop to now the tip C bridle.

4. Add new bridle for tip B to connect to A group at tip( I just larks head onto the bottom of it).

5. Add lcl extensions to Z bridles at tips.

My measurements ALL in mm for my 18m A15 You may have to convert them.

Mixertest- B+98

Blimit- 525

New B tip to A bridle- 1037

Z extensions (5 total) from tip inward- 157,117,71,45,27

Total length of center A bridle from A main top - 7595 - this I think you could use to calculate the lengths for a 9m or other sizes.

Other measurements that are not needed but may help

Reduce Z approx- 600

A main (doubled in half +extension) -1060

B main - unchanged

Converting measurements

I would look for input on this, but I guess you could use my (Total length of center A bridle from A main top - 7595) and compare to yours for a % change.

Otherwise you can use the formula that was used on the Fun Alex Aurora mod which is Length*(squareroot your kite size/squareroot my kite size).

I would think that only these need converting

New B tip to A bridle- 1037

Z extensions (5 total) from tip inward- 157,117,71,45,27

with the formula for a 9m they become

New B tip to A bridle- 691

Z extensions (5 total) from tip inward- 105,78,47,30,18

Converting the mixer

I doubled the A main in half and added an extension at the bottom to get the B limit correct. I connected the other pulley on an extension off the front main. The front end of the pulley line connects to the front of the loop on the B pulley. I added a overhand simple knot to the end of the pulley line to stop it at the pulley. I shortened the Z main with a larkshead back onto a 8 knot on it, like FS has used to adjust things. I also connected it to an 8 knot on the middle of the rear main for quick adjustment. I suggest adjusting the A main for the B limit and Z for the mixer test. B has no adjustment and does not need it.

Additional notes

The Z extensions, increase L/D and stability but affect turning. They are quite tolerant to different lengths.

The B tip bridle affects the kite quite a bit, maybe play with it.

It is a work still in progress, but good so far. Hopefully you or others can offer ideas.

Regis-de-giens
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Fri Apr 26, 2019 5:12 pm

Thanks a lot.

Merci

foilholio
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby foilholio » Sat Apr 27, 2019 2:14 pm

I'll add you should probably measure your current mixer test and Blimit.

Here is my post from shortly after I first started developing the mod nearly a year ago. Some of it is out dated and it is interesting to compare the measurements. B limit has continued to reduce, I will have to restore that next, wish I measured when new.
foilholio wrote:
Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:15 am
First things are not 100% final, but I am as said very happy so far, I do need to test more. I don't have measurements, but can take them later. My measurements for the 18m most likely will not translate directly to the 9m. There is a formula for bridle size conversion, I will have to look for it unless someone else can share it. It is not always exactly correct in the figures it produces. This is most likely because the setup for different sizes needs to be slightly different. What I can do now is share how I did the mod, so you can replicate it on your 9m.

First you will want some measurements. You'll need 2 screw drivers and a measuring tape.

With the kite laid out on some grass, fix both front mains together with a screwdriver in the ground. Now I measured all full depowered endpoints for B C and Z and A main and pulley lines, everything there on the mixer. What is only needed for this mod is the difference between A and B, or the AB limit. I have the numbers for mine which "may be similar" to yours. My AB limit was 544mm. This measurement is wrong from new as my mixer has already shrunk. But it is still working, as B is still going slack at the edge of the window, which was the behavior at new. The negative to this being shorter is obviously less depower, but the kite won't fly forward as easy strt winds particularly from the center window.

Next I fixed separately both front and rear mains so both A and Z mains are equal at the top. A mixer test. I measured both C and B difference from AZ. You only need B, my measurement was B +105mm.

First you will need about 2-3meters of kite line and something to cut it before proceeding.

Lay out one mixer so you can start disassembling it without getting confused where the lines all go. Use nice big bit of space to do this. Keep the other mixer untouched so you can reference it for how things joined up before.

Disassemble the front and rear mains from pulley lines and AZ mains and front and rear lines. Always try preserve the open layout of the mixer while things are disconnected so you can easily reassemble without crossing or TWISTING things!

Remove the C pulley line completely, it's gone :-)

Remove the B Pulley line and attach it to the front side of the B pulley.

Remove the C pulley, make a small 2-3inch kite line loop that goes the C pulley and has a 8 knot on the end.

Remove the A Main from the A bridles, double it over and reconnect the sewn ends to the A bridles. Make a 20cm kite line loop with 8 knot A main extension. Larkshead the A main double loop end under the 8 knot.

Assemble the Amain extension , C pulley loop and front main. Make a 50cm kite line loop with 8 knot front line extension. Larkshead the front line to above the knot. Attach frontline extension to front main. The mixer is now coming together!

Thread the B Pulley line through from the top of the C pulley and then through the front of the B Pulley. Be carefully not to twist it at all.

Make an overhand knot on the stitched section of the B pulley line loose end. Do this away from the Loop.

Make an 8 knot on the Z main 40cm up from the loose end. Larkshead the Z main loose end back onto itself above the knot. This is a little tricky if you have never done it before. This forms an adjustable loop on the Z main bottom.

Attach the rear main to the B pulley line. Move the over hand knot to be hard or close against the rear main but dont use the rear main as part of it.

Make a 8 knot in the middle of the rear main. Larkshead the bottom of the Z adjustment loop to the bottom of that knot.

Reconnect the rear line to rear main. The mixer is now fully connected and only needs to be adjusted.

Adjust the C pulley loop to about an inch or smaller.

Screw driver the front mains. Adjusted the A main length till the AB limit is the same as before.

Do a mixer test and adjust the Z adjustment loop till B is the same as before. When adjusting these loops you will need to be careful to balance them before tightening the larksheads.



When making the loops for the first mixer, if you cut for the second it will go much faster!

Repeat everything for the second mixer. You should be able to just copy the lengths off the first, Infact things like the C Pulley loop and A mains should be copied, UNLESS there is symmetry problems, which you can now fix with all the adjustments you have!

Remove ALL THE C BRIDLES.

Move the 2 tip B bridles, to the C attachments, 2 loops around the attachment LCL on the outer then 1 to the inner.

Fly the kite, adjust the trim at the bar, then at the front line adjustment.

Test and have play with things. You have a easy adjustment for Z, move the larks head to the Zmain, B pulley line join to lengthen and get more stability, better upwind. Move it down to the Front line front main join to shorten and get more power. If you want to adjust it further, adjust the loop on the Z main. The mixer test on the A15 doesn't seem to translate quite right when the mixer changes like this. The camber increase is less on this mixer and most likely the mixer test on the A15 does not measure at the correct sheeting point. You will need to play with Z to get exactly what you want. I highly suggest trying the 3 settings for different conditions so you can get a feel for their advantages and disadvantages.

Good luck and don't hesitate to ask me to explain more for you. If you are confused about something I write ask me! :-)

Regis-de-giens
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Posts: 1115
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:58 pm
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Local Beach: France: St Laurent du Var, Cannes, Almanarre
Style: 62 kg , light wind
Gear: Conceptair pulsion 15&12&.369 , Elf 11 &7, OR Flite 10m , Airush One 9&6, Rally 6&4.
foil Ketos, Zone, OR mako, snowskis, kite-boat
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Sun May 05, 2019 12:52 pm

Mine is now sold

foilholio
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Re: pansh a15 in 9m

Postby foilholio » Sun May 05, 2019 10:43 pm

Well that is sad. I was looking forward to your feedback, and you may have reconsidered the kite given the improvement.

The info is there, maybe the new owner will consider the mod or someone else.


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