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Flysurfer Soul

For all foil kite riders
Kristan
Rare Poster
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 9:50 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Plescheevo lake
Style: Freeride
Gear: Kites: Flysurfer Soul 12m, Blade Fat Lady 17m, Flysurfer Pulse2 14m. Boards: Crazyfly Raptor 140x42, Flysurfer Flydoor4 170x50
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Russia, Moscow
Has thanked: 2 times
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Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby Kristan » Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:25 pm

This is it, I'm done.

Today was my sixth session with the 12m Soul. Because of my previous unsuccessful session in nuking wind I had my lines all messed up, which I fixed at home. Just for unrolling the kite today and untangle the lines again! Minus 20-30 minutes of not riding. Sorted out the lines, launching. Now I had to strap myself to the snowboard somehow, because I could not stall it. The wind was quite various from 10 to 20 knots. So I've put the kite at 2 o'clock, pulled the bar to the hook and trying to reach for the straps with my free arm. And there Soul, as usual, collapses. Nosedives, folds in half and falling on the people and parked kites that are downwind. And of course ends up in a bowtie, so I had to eject. My instructor catches the kite and says:
- What happened? Everything was alright.
- This kite doesn't fly well in the gusts.
- Haven't I seen you few weeks ago struggling with your kite?
- Yup, it happens quite often.
- Maybe you should consider switching to an inflatable?
- I'm thinking about that as well, this kite is pissing me off.

That's it, now I'm famous on my spot for not riding with my fancy foil kite, but rather struggling with it. So I'm going to untangle the lines again. For some reason I had Z line between B and C rows, but I couldn't get it out no matter what, until I detached it completely from the mixer. Ok, sorted the lines and trying to launch again, this time with snowboard already attached. Launched mostly fine, with a tiny tie on the wingtip that I shook off. I'd say this kite has quite amazing wind range, since I had quite harsh gusts, but with PP trimmer I have managed to almost completely negate them. Unfortunately I had to use this trimmer all the time, since wind could not decide if it wanted to die off to 8 knots or nuke around 24 knots, and that happened almost every minute.

Another unpleasant moment happened when I have tried to stop for some rest. Most of times I'd just pull the steering lines and backstall my kite. But not this time, it jumped and was quite powered. I've tried to put it on 2 o'clock again, but it collapsed again, fell down and automatically relaunched itself. I couldn't even put it on the leading edge, it rolled over and relaunched again. So I had to eject it again. After some rest I have relaunched it. Hello bowtie, my old friend. Few minutes of struggle and I shook it off. Then I proceeded with my session, but not for long, because a stormcloud was approaching, so I had to wrap it up.

That's it, I'm going to sell this kite. It did not give me what I have expected from it, but it gave me the troubles I did not expect. This time I'm going to buy me a 14m LEI and go kiting with less of a headache.

andylc
Frequent Poster
Posts: 390
Joined: Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:26 pm
Kiting since: 2005
Local Beach: Exmouth
Favorite Beaches: Saunton Sands
Gear: Flysurfer Soul 8m, 12m
Lieuwe Shotgun 132
Brand Affiliation: None
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Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby andylc » Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:58 pm

You've clearly made your decision, and as always the Soul is not the perfect kite like some might be suggesting. However the behaviour you describe is just plain ridiculous. I would struggle to get it to do that if I tried. Also what kite do you expect to behave in wind between 8 and 24 knots, if this is actually true?

Kristan
Rare Poster
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 9:50 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Plescheevo lake
Style: Freeride
Gear: Kites: Flysurfer Soul 12m, Blade Fat Lady 17m, Flysurfer Pulse2 14m. Boards: Crazyfly Raptor 140x42, Flysurfer Flydoor4 170x50
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Russia, Moscow
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby Kristan » Sun Mar 03, 2019 7:11 pm

andylc wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:58 pm
You've clearly made your decision, and as always the Soul is not the perfect kite like some might be suggesting. However the behaviour you describe is just plain ridiculous. I would struggle to get it to do that if I tried. Also what kite do you expect to behave in wind between 8 and 24 knots, if this is actually true?
Soul seems like have been made for smoother sea winds, with less gusts and turbulence. I mean it works well in the gusty conditions as long as I kept moving. But as soon as I stop there are problems. And it's not always with various winds like today, I still had those problems in better wind conditions.

User avatar
Adventure Logs
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 612
Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:18 pm
Kiting since: 2011
Local Beach: Punta del Diablo, Uruguay
Favorite Beaches: Durban, SA
Corpus Christi
Gear: Flysurfer Psycho, Speed, Sonic, Soul
Flysurfer Flysplit M, L
Nobile T5
Nobile Infinity Split with Zen Foil, NHP Carbon Split
Slightshot hoverglide
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Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby Adventure Logs » Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:35 pm

Kristan wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 7:11 pm
andylc wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:58 pm
You've clearly made your decision, and as always the Soul is not the perfect kite like some might be suggesting. However the behaviour you describe is just plain ridiculous. I would struggle to get it to do that if I tried. Also what kite do you expect to behave in wind between 8 and 24 knots, if this is actually true?
Soul seems like have been made for smoother sea winds, with less gusts and turbulence. I mean it works well in the gusty conditions as long as I kept moving. But as soon as I stop there are problems. And it's not always with various winds like today, I still had those problems in better wind conditions.
Foils are admittedly, not the best for gusty conditions, but I've never had a problem with my Soul and I've dealt with gusty lakes and huge wind shadows. Just some people just can't get the hang of flying a foil. You have to always be actively flying in in large gusts. Usually a safety pull requires a walk up the lines for me.

If the kite is indeed acting in the manner you are describing then I still say there is something VERY wrong for the leading edge to collapse like that. I'm going to vote on a snag or tangle somewhere in the A row. Also NEVER take apart your bridle to untangle a mess. There's absolutely no reason every to do so and you are greatly increasing the chance of making the issue worse since you have no experiences with foil bridles.

I think this issue is a combination of very low foil flying skills, gusty home spot, a bridal tangle, and just the lack of someone there with experience flying a foil kite. Too bad there wasn't someone in your area that's already flown and are familiar with flysurfer kites that could help you out.

cwood
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Posts: 438
Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2015 7:28 pm
Kiting since: 2014
Local Beach: Cherry Beach, Toronto
Gear: Flysurfer
Moses Hydrofoil
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Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby cwood » Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:40 pm

Adventure Logs wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:35 pm
Kristan wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 7:11 pm
andylc wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:58 pm
You've clearly made your decision, and as always the Soul is not the perfect kite like some might be suggesting. However the behaviour you describe is just plain ridiculous. I would struggle to get it to do that if I tried. Also what kite do you expect to behave in wind between 8 and 24 knots, if this is actually true?
Soul seems like have been made for smoother sea winds, with less gusts and turbulence. I mean it works well in the gusty conditions as long as I kept moving. But as soon as I stop there are problems. And it's not always with various winds like today, I still had those problems in better wind conditions.
Foils are admittedly, not the best for gusty conditions, but I've never had a problem with my Soul and I've dealt with gusty lakes and huge wind shadows. Just some people just can't get the hang of flying a foil. You have to always be actively flying in in large gusts. Usually a safety pull requires a walk up the lines for me.

If the kite is indeed acting in the manner you are describing then I still say there is something VERY wrong for the leading edge to collapse like that. I'm going to vote on a snag or tangle somewhere in the A row. Also NEVER take apart your bridle to untangle a mess. There's absolutely no reason every to do so and you are greatly increasing the chance of making the issue worse since you have no experiences with foil bridles.

I think this issue is a combination of very low foil flying skills, gusty home spot, a bridal tangle, and just the lack of someone there with experience flying a foil kite. Too bad there wasn't someone in your area that's already flown and are familiar with flysurfer kites that could help you out.
yes the reference to bridle layers being mixed is a good indication of pretty significant issue! Tip, bridle sorting with flying lines off, start at the kite and get the top layer clear to the pigtail, then work from there to sort out the other layers.

It is also very much the case that there are some people that just don't want the extra hassle of foil bridles etc. If you don't see the ROI in getting comfortable then yes, inflatables are a good choice!

Kristan
Rare Poster
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 9:50 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Plescheevo lake
Style: Freeride
Gear: Kites: Flysurfer Soul 12m, Blade Fat Lady 17m, Flysurfer Pulse2 14m. Boards: Crazyfly Raptor 140x42, Flysurfer Flydoor4 170x50
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Russia, Moscow
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby Kristan » Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:56 pm

Adventure Logs wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:35 pm

Foils are admittedly, not the best for gusty conditions, but I've never had a problem with my Soul and I've dealt with gusty lakes and huge wind shadows. Just some people just can't get the hang of flying a foil. You have to always be actively flying in in large gusts. Usually a safety pull requires a walk up the lines for me.

If the kite is indeed acting in the manner you are describing then I still say there is something VERY wrong for the leading edge to collapse like that. I'm going to vote on a snag or tangle somewhere in the A row. Also NEVER take apart your bridle to untangle a mess. There's absolutely no reason every to do so and you are greatly increasing the chance of making the issue worse since you have no experiences with foil bridles.

I think this issue is a combination of very low foil flying skills, gusty home spot, a bridal tangle, and just the lack of someone there with experience flying a foil kite. Too bad there wasn't someone in your area that's already flown and are familiar with flysurfer kites that could help you out.
There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with the bridles. I have checked them multiple times and I know how to check them for overlaps. I have checked them at home, where is no wind, putting every row at its designated area, checked the mixer for twists. And I assure you there is not an issue in the bridles, I'm 100% sure about it, so please stop pointing at it, it's no use.

Even when I had to detach the mixer and the bridles lines I have attached them back as they used to be. I mean I did not detach the whole row, but only line by line. Then I triple checked if there are no twists or overlaps. So again, not an issue.

The issue that the kite by design is flawed. Seriously flawed. For some reason you folks are trying to deny this because you did not have such problems. And there are two explanations to that, either you have better wind conditions with smoother winds, or I have received a defected kite from a defected batch. But I'm not that sure about kite being defected, rather than believe that it's not suited for our turbulent conditions.

jatem
Rare Poster
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:16 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Sth Island NZ
Style: Foil
Gear: J Shapes Pocket 100 board with Cruzer + Freeride wings
Flysurfer Soul 10m
Flysurfer Peak 4m, 5m
Cabrinha Drifter 5.5m, 8m
Ozone Uno 4m
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Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby jatem » Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:06 pm

Kristan wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 7:11 pm
andylc wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:58 pm
Also what kite do you expect to behave in wind between 8 and 24 knots, if this is actually true?
Soul seems like have been made for smoother sea winds, with less gusts and turbulence. I mean it works well in the gusty conditions as long as I kept moving. But as soon as I stop there are problems. And it's not always with various winds like today, I still had those problems in better wind conditions.
If you're after a kite for unstable wind, the Peak 4 is a much better choice.

I usually ride LEI wave kites on the hydrofoil when it's windy, and a Soul on light days. Recently I've been frustrated by a turbulent launch site. It's a harbour launch area with a wind shadow and a rock wall which makes LEIs back stall in the lulls and then suddenly front stall in the gusts. It's scary with a LEI kite. I bought a Flysurfer Peak 4 this week specifically for this sketchy launch area. Compared to my LEI wave kites, the stability, drift and easy handling of the Peak 4 is next level. It has completely tamed this turbulent launch area, which is often 5-20knots. The Peak 4 just wants to stay in the air. It flies nothing like a Soul, no need to move the peak around, it's like it has automatic front and back stall prevention.

andylc
Frequent Poster
Posts: 390
Joined: Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:26 pm
Kiting since: 2005
Local Beach: Exmouth
Favorite Beaches: Saunton Sands
Gear: Flysurfer Soul 8m, 12m
Lieuwe Shotgun 132
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 0
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Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby andylc » Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:23 pm

If as you say you believe it to be defective - and from what you say it does not fly anything like the Soul I know - why do you not send it back to Flysurfer?? Their guarantee is one of the major plus points of the brand.

Kristan
Rare Poster
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 9:50 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Plescheevo lake
Style: Freeride
Gear: Kites: Flysurfer Soul 12m, Blade Fat Lady 17m, Flysurfer Pulse2 14m. Boards: Crazyfly Raptor 140x42, Flysurfer Flydoor4 170x50
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Russia, Moscow
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby Kristan » Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:25 pm

jatem wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:06 pm

If you're after a kite for unstable wind, the Peak 4 is a much better choice.

I usually ride LEI wave kites on the hydrofoil when it's windy, and a Soul on light days. Recently I've been frustrated by a turbulent launch site. It's a harbour launch area with a wind shadow and a rock wall which makes LEIs back stall in the lulls and then suddenly front stall in the gusts. It's scary with a LEI kite. I bought a Flysurfer Peak 4 this week specifically for this sketchy launch area. Compared to my LEI wave kites, the stability, drift and easy handling of the Peak 4 is next level. It has completely tamed this turbulent launch area, which is often 5-20knots. The Peak 4 just wants to stay in the air. It flies nothing like a Soul, no need to move the peak around, it's like it has automatic front and back stall prevention.
As far as I know Peak 4 doesn't jump much. It's good for freeride and mountains, but that's it. When I aimed for Soul, I wished for a kite that I could use both on snow and water, which Peak can not do. And jumps. Soul jumps really good. But I'm afraid that is one of the few pros that I found in a ton of cons of this kite.

Kristan
Rare Poster
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 9:50 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Plescheevo lake
Style: Freeride
Gear: Kites: Flysurfer Soul 12m, Blade Fat Lady 17m, Flysurfer Pulse2 14m. Boards: Crazyfly Raptor 140x42, Flysurfer Flydoor4 170x50
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Russia, Moscow
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Flysurfer Soul

Postby Kristan » Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:30 pm

andylc wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:23 pm
If as you say you believe it to be defective - and from what you say it does not fly anything like the Soul I know - why do you not send it back to Flysurfer?? Their guarantee is one of the major plus points of the brand.
I'm not sure if it's defected. Although having displaced mixer settings out of the bag, plus broken mixer line after three session made me a bit suspicious.

I mean, it flies, it pulls, it jumps. But oh boy it's capricious. I can't say that it's defected just because of that, that reason won't be justified.

Besides I have problems with returning the kite to FS dealer, since Russia doesn't actually have one. I'll have to send it to Estonia, which by my means, not worth it.


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