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Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 10:15 am
by haare
Hello,

I wanted to list here all the great tips I have found to fine tune your foil kite.
This works for all foil kites, however tuning is easiest with ozone and flysurfer because they will publish their line plans.

1) Tuning mixer. Legendary video made by Armin himself. He also explains the profile changes quite well here
https://vimeo.com/9488886

2) Gunnars very good video about fixing kites by measuring bridle. This video was hugely important for me and has helped me a lot with my tuning troubles.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5twzrtvTP4

3) Flysurfer soul designer talk. Explains quite well the different tuning options of flysurfer kites. PMAs etc.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5grUtFc63GY&t=1596s

4) Russian foil expert extending D/Z line to improve kite performance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUSH0Kjje5A

5) Kitetech video of tuning mixer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXabqal8524

6) Flysurfer short video of mixertest
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a62GnLXudj8

7) Ozone mixer test for protune system
https://ozonekites.com/videos/play/pro- ... eed-system

I Think that you can fix most problems with the first 2 videos. However if your kite still handles poorly you need to check the whole bridle. I made a short video of this. Sorry about the poor quality and bad english.
https://youtu.be/93Te2HGlXwY

Re: Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:21 pm
by Mossy 757
Great work, thanks for compiling this!

Re: Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:38 pm
by jakemoore
Excellent list. Before anything else: check line lengths.

Re: Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 10:31 pm
by Nash556
Great post

Re: Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:05 pm
by mgs
Very useful links and thanks for posting them.
Being able to recognise when your kite is “out of tune” and the logical steps you need to take in order to “re-tune” it is a good skill to learn.
Making your own bridles is handy as well.

Re: Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:13 pm
by kitexpert
Actually Armin's video is a bit misleading. He claims kite increases camber when its AoA is increased, even though his drawing suggests that is not happening. And when decreasing AoA camber is claimed to decrease for bigger positive momentum, again picture does not prove it (Armin draws a low cambered airfoil out of his head).

It is true in FS kites camber is indeed increased/decreased, but Armin does not explain why and his drawing (although exemplary) does not prove it, but more like disproves it.

I'm not sure if it is that kind of videos which had caused so much confusion among some bridle tinkerers. Some have messed up quite bad three different things which happen (or not happen) when bar of the depowerable kite is sheeted in/out. These three are:

1) kite changes AoA
2) kite changes camber (if it is designed to do so)
3) some mixer adjustment (preset) for camber is in effect

Only 1) is elementary for powering up/depower, it is always there if kite is depowerable. 2) is a useful invention, but kite works well without it and 3) is mainly a method to get kite back to its original tune, to counter line length variation.

3) has some potential to adjust kite for personal taste/use, but when doing so some other properties of kite will suffer. It is foolish to think to get a decent kite generally better by tweaking the mixer. No matter how many hours tinkering is done PanshA15 will not become Soul - opposite is very possible though :)

Re: Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 1:26 am
by foilholio
Yes "kitexpert" we all now know you think you know more than Mr Armin Harich. BTW where is your Flysurfer company that makes cutting edge foil kites? Oh you don't have one, you just make tubes.
kitexpert wrote: 1) kite changes AoA
2) kite changes camber (if it is designed to do so)
3) some mixer adjustment (preset) for camber is in effect
You forgot one there, 4) Kite changes PA (projected area) or arc. Points 2 and 3 are the same, you struggle with english don't you. So it is better summarized as

Kite changes
1) AoA
2) Camber
3) PA

3 things, it's like triple ways, like a Triple Depower. Amazing who would have thought.

Oh and it's is even further summarized as

Kite changes SHAPE

Amazing I know, and I doubt you have observed this ( because tube designers have such low IQ)but even tube kites "Change shape" making point 1,2,3 applicable but not really used well or understood much because again the low IQ thing.

As to Armin's Video, I have not watched it again but from memory it is fine. I'll have another look when I get a chance. Who knows you do occasionally make valid points, like a gem in shit.

Re: Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:01 pm
by direnc
Very useful post and compilation of links! Thanks!

foilholio and kitexpert, you both seem to have lots of free time. Rather than arguing with each other, would each of you please take the time to write up a fool-proof, step by step and complete foil kite tuning/troubleshooting tutorial?

Re: Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:05 pm
by sabraxas
Kite expert and foilholio, can you explain how camber of profile is changed when aoa and lower skin área changed lineally?

And how arc and projected área of Foil Kite is changed?

Thanks

Re: Foil Kite tuning tips

Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:05 pm
by kitexpert
foilholio wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 1:26 am
Points 2 and 3 are the same, you struggle with english don't you.
:lol: No. This confirms my doubts you foilholio still don't understand this kind of things.
foilholio wrote: we all now know you think you know more than Mr Armin Harich.
I don't care who it is, if it is not correctly explained I correct it. You foilholio are a living example Armin's presentation is not clear enough, aren't you? But I'm not sure if you can be helped...
direnc wrote: Rather than arguing with each other, would each of you please take the time to write up a fool-proof, step by step and complete foil kite tuning/troubleshooting tutorial?
I'm afraid correcting foilholio's weird advices and trying to teach him the basics are enough :roll: Fool-proofing is really too much asked.