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Kitech FRS

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Kitech FRS

Postby Peter_Frank » Wed Nov 04, 2020 8:33 am

TomW wrote:
Tue Nov 03, 2020 10:47 pm
I think that's the right way to put it. Its been tamed. It Flys in controlled fashion in the wind its designed for. It doesn't zoom thru the wind window too fast, and doesn't require Supreme timing to hit the power peak before it Lulls at window edge.
It doesn't do radical loop with a little pull on the bar.

I know its not a fair comparison but my 4,5 concept air wave is difficult to handle, its so fast through the power zone and will kite loop if I'm not careful. I'd prefer that kite to be tamer. I use the CA Wave on 23m lines.

Still have to use the frs6 in higher winds to get a feeling for its behavior.

Sometimes a great feature - as it gives you loads more range, if it can shoot through the window fast.
But more difficult to handle indeed, and not as easy for waves.

Eventhough, reading tests, I got the impression Concept Air Wave does not have more peak power than the Peak4's?

And Peak4's are really slow (flying).

If you make a kite sit deeper, meaning slower flying (higher drag), it will automatically be "tamed" somewhat, in terms of how fast it reacts to turning.

Whereas if the sheeting distance is small, any kite will feel like a handful of wasps, difficult almost impossible to control :rollgrin:

There are three parameters, which often interact, but not always.
Flying speed - turning ability - sheeting distance.

I think this is why these threads often gets confusing :roll:

In particular as the english term "Fast", is not good, as it is most often used regarding how fast a board or kite turns, but it can also be flying speed - and these parameters can often be quite contradictive.

8) Peter

merl
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Re: Kitech FRS

Postby merl » Wed Nov 04, 2020 10:53 am

I'm not sure that the 4.5 wave can be called difficult to handle, or whether it makes sense to compare it with a 6m kite! My experience is that the 4.5 is not so aggressive for its size. I can only compare it to the 5m peak where it has more peak power in the loop, but the correct comparison would be with the 4m peak.

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Re: Kitech FRS

Postby Peter_Frank » Wed Nov 04, 2020 11:11 am

merl wrote:
Wed Nov 04, 2020 10:53 am
I'm not sure that the 4.5 wave can be called difficult to handle, or whether it makes sense to compare it with a 6m kite! My experience is that the 4.5 is not so aggressive for its size. I can only compare it to the 5m peak where it has more peak power in the loop, but the correct comparison would be with the 4m peak.
Makes sense, so it has a bit faster flying characteristics, but less static power, thus 4.5 m2 Wave corresponds more to the 4 m2 Peak4 in size, thats also my impressions from test - although I did not know the powerspike was higher on the Conceptair, till now.

Slightly off topic if this is an FRS thread, but still important regarding whether and how kites are deliberately slowed down in some respects :naughty:

8) Peter

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Re: Kitech FRS

Postby Schietwedder » Thu Nov 05, 2020 6:33 pm

What should not to be forgotten in flying speed for example when looping is the bar setting.
5cm shorter or longer front lines can make a huge difference in flying speed as you simply slow/speed up the kite with the initial AoA.
Sometimes looping a powered foilkite is producing less power if you are short before backstall and therefore fly slowly than propellering the kite into a loop and then releasing with low AoA but a fast kite.

I fly my selfmade protos with a 70cm bar and can adjust the frontlines +-10cm in comparision to the backlines. I often find my self used to a certain bar position so I try to bring the power sweetspot (initial AoA vs flying speed/loop diameter) of the kite to where I put my bar naturally and of course acc. to the wind condition.
The setting of 10cm difference on the front lines can make a kite feel from a slow lumb to a go cart.

With a long bar you have the possibility of moving the range where it loops and respnoses fast way up to a more sheeted out position.

I think most foils bigger than 11m² are flown with too short bars and have too short bar throw.

Accordingly if you use really small foils shorter bar and high initial AoA will slow it down properly.

Especially with foil kites that are not sold/tuned for a certain bar one should play around with more range on the trim rope that the bar comes normally with or some pigtails extending the front/ back lines on the mixer.

Because the mixer also doesn´t mix the AoA lineary but also cambers/ reflexes the profile, I use linear pigtails above the mixer (+/- 1cm on B; +/-2cm on C; +-3cm on D) to move the non linear motion of B, C and D rows back and forth the depower range so you end up with a more reflexed/cambered airfoil at different bar position.
You should expect that from a brand that they already found the best setting for 90% of the users for the standard bar but with this technique you can make a totally different kite if you know what you´re doing and adjust it 100% to your own preferences.

So I think 80% of the times when people argue about certain kites and comparisions the biggest difference is sometimes the bars/settings and not the kites.

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Re: Kitech FRS

Postby TomW » Sat Nov 28, 2020 1:44 pm

I had a session last Sunday on 6m FRS.12ms with gusts into 15 ms. Windfinder said 17ms. 1,5m windswell with chop on top. 20m lines , 80 kg , 1000cm2 foil, Gong veloce M.

I was very powered and at times over powered, had to drift kite in gybes it was so strong wind and big steep swells with short period. Sketchy launch, but kite inflates in air almost instantly.

One gybe I flew downwind and kite rushed to edge of window and i was on my way to a round the world. The kite luffed, inverted and crashed to the water blowing out the TE vents. I got it sorted and up again and it flew fine with the vents open. 100% rider error.
Kite works really well in high winds. I probably should have had 15m lines. It was limit of top end.

2 weeks ago I had 6-9ms session. Thats wind I would usually use my 9m hyperlink v2. Still had fun even though there were a few lulls and did stall launch. Quite impressive low end for a 6m. I even could do heel to toeside tacks, kite has good lift, upwind glide at 1200 and fast redirect. Its improvement over hyperlink 7m V1.


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