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Hello Everyone,

Been away from kiteforum for a few years as I progressed from a beginner to an intermediate. I was given great advice on gear the last time around.

Recently started hydrofoiling and after 5 sessions I feel i have progressed to a decent level (Riding on the foil in ocean swell confidently, light wind launches not a problem, currently learning to air gybe but its a slow process and can touch down gybe at some level of consistency).

Now I feel my choice of kites is (11m shiva 3d and a 7m gastra spark) starting to become an issue. It is a large power gap to bridge on a foil and I often find the 7m is very heavy and does not lend itself well to foiling with frequent hidenburgs as I foil downwind towards it especially in 15-18 knots conditions.

Flysurfer foil kites are very popular at my local beach in particular with people riding hydrofoils but are currently out of my price range. I was thinking of a PANSH to try out foil kites and get a feel for them, the pricing is very attractive.

In particular if anyone has any comparisons between the Aurora II 8m and the A15me 9m. Which is the more modern kite and would be more suitable for foiling? Is the ultralight material needed at that size?

Also both appear to be 5 line kites but the 5th is not under tension? In that case can I just use a 4 line bar which flags to a single line?

Thank you for any advice!

Hindenburg in 15-18knot that's a joke right

I think A15 will be better in that size because AR is lower and is more stable. Ultralight will always fly better, you will start to see benefit at 15knots but it is not really necessary till 10-12knots. Also consider a 9m will most likely replace your 11m. Maybe just save the money on ultralight, so if you are not happy with foils less loss, plus regular fabric will be more durable.

I personally think the A15 is more advanced, but you will get more performance from the Aurora 2. Also consider my mod for the A15 increases performance and changes it a lot.

The fifth line is slack and just for safety. It is not compulsory and will detracted from performance because of drag. Yes single line flag is fine.

foilholio wrote: Hindenburg in 15-18knot that's a joke right

I think A15 will be better in that size because AR is lower and is more stable. Ultralight will always fly better, you will start to see benefit at 15knots but it is not really necessary till 10-12knots. Also consider a 9m will most likely replace your 11m. Maybe just save the money on ultralight, so if you are not happy with foils less loss, plus regular fabric will be more durable.

I personally think the A15 is more advanced, but you will get more performance from the Aurora 2. Also consider my mod for the A15 increases performance and changes it a lot.

The fifth line is slack and just for safety. It is not compulsory and will detracted from performance because of drag. Yes single line flag is fine.

Unfortunately it isn't it hates any line slack at all and if there is a large amount of slack the wind get on top of the canopy and she goes down like a stone! 11m just floats in comparison.

Interesting on your comparisons, I think as you say I will stay away from ultralight until I decide if I like foils and keep the cost low.

In relation to the bridle mods for the A15 I would say I would not be at all confident when it comes to modding bridles all I have ever done in the past in change pigtail positions on the LEIS to give more power. Out of the box is the Aurora 2 better set up with no tweaking needed?

A15 needs no tweaking out of the box. Mine has received tweaking because I do that with any kite, even LEIs.

You may prefer the Aurora 2 more out of the box, hard to say as everyone's style is different. Just saying with the mod there is more potential to be had or a change if you want with the A15. Aurora 2 is going to have much shorter bar throw than an unmodded A15.

All foils need tweaking eventually. Their bridles change significantly in the first few months. It's why flysurfer has adjustments. At the basic level it is not much different than moving pigtail knots. You are just changing the length of something. It is just with foils there is a lot of strings you can change the length of and you often need to add your own pigtails or knots. There is only really one thing you should play with at first the Z main. It's simple to understand once you have played with it's length a little.

Not sure how I got onto this but wow these kites are very inexpensive! So I am looking for a kite to get me down to below 10 knots... maybe as low as 6 knots if its possible. I can go out with my impulse foil and 10m Flite down to about 8/9 knots but its sketchy and there is a lot of slack lines in my turns... (skill needs improvements) I was looking at the Lecca Lecca but the I am not sure if the 11m is big enough for what I am trying to do and I think the 15m would definitely be too big for my surf foil.
Can anyone comment on the power of the 12m Aurora II. Would that work for what I am trying to do?

What is your weight ?
Aurora 12m will give you more power than the 10m flite and relaunch better and support better slack lines (Flite is not wonderful on this point). But far slower so slack line management during a gibe is another type of challenge at your starts.

Aurora15m should give you a little lower end if you are above 65 kg approx and focussing on lower end. But even far slower, trickier to loop on a HF gibe, less fun and worse high end. So 12m vs 15 m depends on your weight and foil size : I would say 70/75kg is the reasonnable balance point if you seek for reasonnable low end. This balance point would be a bit lower (60/65kg) for a even lighter foilkite.

A15 ? Tested in 9m but not 12 or 15. 12m should be very good if not looking for speed vs Aurora: more stable and better relaunch than Aurora. Easier as first foilkite, waterstart and foil-up, it also supports longer lines IMO. But a bit more lateral traction. A15 in 15m on a HF ... i do not know, maybe its compact ratio starts to be a bit low in both low wind and high wind due to the high speed of the HF.

Light cloth is necessary to differenciate from the very good OR Flite.

Regis-de-giens wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:51 pm

What is your weight ?
Aurora 12m will give you more power than the 10m flite and relaunch better and support better slack lines (Flite is not wonderful on this point). But far slower so slack line management during a gibe is another type of challenge at your starts.

Aurora15m should give you a little lower end if you are above 65 kg approx and focussing on lower end. But even far slower, trickier to loop on a HF gibe, less fun and worse high end. So 12m vs 15 m depends on your weight and foil size : I would say 70/75kg is the reasonnable balance point if you seek for reasonnable low end. This balance point would be a bit lower (60/65kg) for a even lighter foilkite.

A15 ? Tested in 9m but not 12 or 15. 12m should be very good if not looking for speed vs Aurora: more stable and better relaunch than Aurora. Easier as first foilkite, waterstart and foil-up, it also supports longer lines IMO. But a bit more lateral traction. A15 in 15m on a HF ... i do not know, maybe its compact ratio starts to be a bit low in both low wind and high wind due to the high speed of the HF.

Light cloth is necessary to differenciate from the very good OR Flite.

Thanks Regis-de-giens
My weight is 80kg, I should note I do have the 12m Flite as well but I find it has about the same low end as the 10m for foiling with the impulse.
I did try the 12m Gong in about 7- 8 knots the other day and that worked pretty good it hung in the air when my Flite was a handful to keep flying, I was able to fly the Flite but unable to get going and onto foil.... well not for very far anyhow.
I am not looking for speed on foil but kite flying speed/turning speed is always nice...

To go sub 8 knots you will most likely want a 15m. At 80kg 15m is a safe bet but 18m is starting to be an option. You could consider a 12m with an 18m later or even at the cheap price more sizes. Ultralight is an absolute must.

I would consider A15 for size 15m and under and Aurora 2 15m and above. Surf is better with A15 but larger Aurora2 will be fine. The main problem with A15 is the long bar throw/trim, you can either mod or use 2:1 bar or get used to it. The bar pressure is exceptionally low, which some may like, but is also changeable with other things. Also A15 will turn tighter but Aurora2 flies faster.

foilholio wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:16 am

To go sub 8 knots you will most likely want a 15m. At 80kg 15m is a safe bet but 18m is starting to be an option. You could consider a 12m with an 18m later or even at the cheap price more sizes. Ultralight is an absolute must.

I would consider A15 for size 15m and under and Aurora 2 15m and above. Surf is better with A15 but larger Aurora2 will be fine. The main problem with A15 is the long bar throw/trim, you can either mod or use 2:1 bar or get used to it. The bar pressure is exceptionally low, which some may like, but is also changeable with other things. Also A15 will turn tighter but Aurora2 flies faster.

thanks Foilholio... is it worth getting the bar just to eliminate any unforseens with my bars or is the 5th line really supposed to be slack. Seems some people say it needs tension?

80 kg : i also vote for 15m2. A frind of mine , 70kg discovered foilkites with my ex-aurora v2 UL 15m. Gained low end on its HF vs his strutless 12m, happy with it , extended its ride low winds, even if complained about the very slow turning (like most large foilkites).

We all agree that a15 will turn better (shorter radius and more powerfull loop) but ride straight and upwind slower than aurora. I think both will work, aurora accepting high end (10 -12 knots ? ) with more comfort but requires a bit more skills in 6-7 knots.

Ps : no need to connect the 5th line on both kites.