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Flysurfer Peak 4

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby Peter_Frank » Wed Jun 10, 2020 9:26 am

jaros wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 8:12 am
I am so impressed with the Peak4 in 4 and 5m2, that I just have to try the 8m2. If someone is ready to sell it (in Europe), send me a PM. Sorry for this... :oops:

I think you will be dissapointed, if you expect something similar as the small ones...

In fact, I often try to avoid it, and use my 5 instead, whenever possible, even if on the lowest possible edge with a 5, I prefer this one over the 8 m2.

The 8 does not start much earlier than the 5 IMO, only a tad, and is a lot slower in every way :roll:

I still might take the 8 instead of a tube, when around 5 knots of wind, but only because I dont need to pump a kite up, faster.

Still need to compare a (9-10 m2) tube and an 8 m2 Peak4 neck and neck one day, in 10 knots, so can not say which I prefer, yet.

8) Peter

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby Brian H » Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:38 pm

I’m using the 8m a lot in winds from 6-10 kts on long lines with large surf wing and if I had a tube kite up I would be swimming. I’m super happy with it .😀😀😀😀

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jaros » Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:00 pm

Peter_Frank wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 9:26 am

I think you will be dissapointed, if you expect something similar as the small ones...

In fact, I often try to avoid it, and use my 5 instead, whenever possible, even if on the lowest possible edge with a 5, I prefer this one over the 8 m2.

The 8 does not start much earlier than the 5 IMO, only a tad, and is a lot slower in every way :roll:

I still might take the 8 instead of a tube, when around 5 knots of wind, but only because I dont need to pump a kite up, faster.

Still need to compare a (9-10 m2) tube and an 8 m2 Peak4 neck and neck one day, in 10 knots, so can not say which I prefer, yet.

8) Peter
I am not looking for marginal wind kite, I only want a kite that I can use instead of the 9 and 12 struttles tube kite, cca 8-10 knots of wind. With longer lines and big bar, maybe it wont be so bad?
Perfect would be if I could try one first, but can not...
If you are not happy with it - would you sell it to me? :D

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jumptheshark » Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:06 pm

Hey Peter, are you using longer lines on the 5m? I know you have used 28m lines a fair bit in the past. I like shorter lines for higher winds, but have to give you the props. I'm trying to max the low end of the 5m and find it makes water starts in iffy conditions LOADS more reliable to not only have the kite on long lines, but the trim fixed specifically for low wind stall free looping.

Like you, my regular bar has a bit of oversheeting available. Nice when riding in the sweet spot, but in 10 knots being off by even a cm in bar position or letting the bar move mid loop really robs the kite of its max power potential compared to working it with properly predetermined fixed trim. Long lines and trimmed to fly nicely (loop repeatedly) in 7-8 knots with the bar pulled in against the stop makes starting in low wind as easy as possible.

For those of you with a trim cleat, it's worth messing around on a light wind day to figure out exactly where that trim spot is and mark it so you can set it and forget it when the wind is light and be sure to get the most power possible. It's much nicer to concentrate only on body and board mechanics with the kite fixed at the optimal trim. Would likely apply just as much to bigger Peaks.
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jumptheshark » Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:27 pm

jaros wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:00 pm

I am not looking for marginal wind kite, I only want a kite that I can use instead of the 9 and 12 struttles tube kite, cca 8-10 knots of wind. With longer lines and big bar, maybe it wont be so bad?
Perfect would be if I could try one first, but can not...
If you are not happy with it - would you sell it to me? :D
It's a little more complicated than that. The 5m peak doesn't have the raw power of a 12m tube, but it flies so much better in light winds and has loads of range by comparison. The 5m is fun up to 16 knots where my 12m cloud was no fun at all above 13. If you max the technique side of things, the 5m peak might match the average 8m for raw power, not quite the same as most 9m tubes, but imho the peak is way easier and far more fun to fly in light wind. Put a tube in the wrong spot and it will fall, where even when you mess up, the peak is pretty easy to recover in as low as 4 knots. You kind of have to experience it to understand how much of a difference that is.

Last year my biggest kite was the 12m cloud and I rarely bothered with it. That kite would start in 10 but be too much in 13. Had a few great sessions on it, but also plenty of frustrating ones, wither swimming or overpowered. Definitely a love hate relationship! I put a lot of time on an 8.5m C.5. Needed likely another knot to get going, but was good when it picked up and by the end of the season considered that my light wind kite.

Both of those kites have been retired by a 5m Peak4. So far I'm getting out more often, same low end, less frustration than last year. So, the Peak doesn't have the low end power of a 12, but its fast, fun and easy enough to more than make up for it. If you are into the idea of maxing your low wind technique, the 5m peak is a GREAT kite. If not your waiting for 11-12 knots for easy use, or better off with a bigger one.
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby Peter_Frank » Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:41 pm

Brian H wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:38 pm
I’m using the 8m a lot in winds from 6-10 kts on long lines with large surf wing and if I had a tube kite up I would be swimming. I’m super happy with it .😀😀😀😀

Hmmm, odd, agree you would be swimming in 6 knots with a tube, yes, but riding in 6 or 7 knots is not possible for me not even with the 11 m2 Peak4 on 30 m lines and big wing.
Maybe riding once up foiling in a gust, but no way I can start.

So no even close to possible with the 8 m2 to ride in 6-7 knots being 77-78 kg, not a chance for me :roll:

In 6 knots a 12 to 15 m2 UL foilkite with loads of power/peak power is needed, and the only thing that works IMO, when 5-6 knots....

From 7 knots a superlight tube on 30 m lines can start foiling for me sometimes, and just about hang.

8) Peter
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jumptheshark » Thu Jun 11, 2020 12:29 pm

Where the 5m has the low end power for 10-15 knots, the 4m is the one with all the range! That is definitely the sweet size for my weight and wing. The responsiveness while depowered is fantastic, and massive gain in freedom of movement and direction.

What a kite.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby Tomlutz » Thu Jun 11, 2020 1:24 pm

Peter_Frank wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:41 pm
Brian H wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:38 pm
I’m using the 8m a lot in winds from 6-10 kts on long lines with large surf wing and if I had a tube kite up I would be swimming. I’m super happy with it .😀😀😀😀
Hmmm, odd, agree you would be swimming in 6 knots with a tube, yes, but riding in 6 or 7 knots is not possible for me not even with the 11 m2 Peak4 on 30 m lines and big wing.

8) Peter
I have the Peak 13m for extactly that reason: I can foil from 5 knots, and need 6 knots to go upwind. But the point is it stays in the air down to 3 knots. I don't have to swim.

Flysurfer Soul 12m/15m: I can also foil from 5 knots and can go upwind at 5 knots (only big wing if Soul 12m), but under 5 knots it drops in the water and is not relaunchable under 7 knots. I have to swim.

In super light wind 6 knots and less there is no relaunchable kite I think if not perfectly well positioned in the water (cobra stance), so the non-relaunchability of the Peak doesn't matter.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby Peter_Frank » Thu Jun 11, 2020 2:27 pm

Tomlutz wrote:
Thu Jun 11, 2020 1:24 pm
Peter_Frank wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:41 pm
Brian H wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:38 pm
I’m using the 8m a lot in winds from 6-10 kts on long lines with large surf wing and if I had a tube kite up I would be swimming. I’m super happy with it .😀😀😀😀

Hmmm, odd, agree you would be swimming in 6 knots with a tube, yes, but riding in 6 or 7 knots is not possible for me not even with the 11 m2 Peak4 on 30 m lines and big wing.

8) Peter
I have the Peak 13m for extactly that reason: I can foil from 5 knots, and need 6 knots to go upwind. But the point is it stays in the air down to 3 knots. I don't have to swim.

Flysurfer Soul 12m/15m: I can also foil from 5 knots and can go upwind at 5 knots (only big wing if Soul 12m), but under 5 knots it drops in the water and is not relaunchable under 7 knots. I have to swim.

In super light wind 6 knots and less there is no relaunchable kite I think if not perfectly well positioned in the water (cobra stance), so the non-relaunchability of the Peak doesn't matter.

Sorry, I dont understand this :roll:

Have never flown a FS Soul, but I would imagine it to have okay peak power, somewhat more than the Peak4, so able to start in less wind on a foil (similar sized) - but according to you not the case, if they start in the same wind?

Agree the Peak4 has awesome "you wont have to swim" abilites when wind drops, great, on cost of going a tad lower upwind.

But something seems wrong if you can not start earlier with the Soul?

For me there is a big difference in Peak power between big Peak4's and good double skin foil kites, and even LEI kites has a tad more peak power (IMO), so this is why I am sceptical.

8) Peter

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby joe f » Thu Jun 11, 2020 5:20 pm

jumptheshark wrote:
Thu Jun 11, 2020 12:29 pm
Where the 5m has the low end power for 10-15 knots, the 4m is the one with all the range! That is definitely the sweet size for my weight and wing. The responsiveness while depowered is fantastic, and massive gain in freedom of movement and direction.

What a kite.
Just back from first session on the 4m (having fallen in love with the 5m a couple of weeks ago). Wow - what a kite! There was a decent breeze (am guessing but definitely over 15kts) to start with and the little 4m was more than powerful enough to pull my 95kg out of the water without having to thrash it all over the sky, which I was doing with the 5m (but in fairly light wind and it was actually good fun flying it so aggressively). Once up on the foil, it is so nice to be able to point wherever you want and just enjoy yourself without thinking about the kite. It was the first time that I really felt more power from the waves than from the kite as you can pretty much depower the kite to nothing or charge directly at it. Pure fun. I have given up worrying about the inevitable swim (which will happen - I just stay closer to the shore now) as I am enjoying the carving and go-kart like fun so much.

The wind picked up quite a bit and it did eventually start to flap. I was worried about flapping, but it is NOT an issue in the right wind range. The kite never felt overpowered though and I was struggling more with the foil (Moses 633) and trying to calm down the insane lift that was being generated than having to fight the kite. Sheet out and the pull goes, but it is still steerable.

Interestingly, the wind kept picking up and I changed 'down' to my 10m Soul on the twin tip. The soul handled the wind no problem and the jumps were very floaty, but it was the first time that I have felt like I was flying a tank. It is hard to describe, but the soul felt very 'heavy' in the air and more like a rhinoceros than a wing. I have loved the Souls but I think my days are numbered now, so very likely to give up on the twin tip entirely (I haven't really enjoyed that for years) and enjoy the Peaks, which are mental and feel like the perfect power source for my (short) foil board and 633 wing.

My only question is the bottom end of the 5m. I reckon that 12kts is realistic for me. I am therefore tempted to get an 8m just to cover the inevitable 10kt days (not interested in less than that really), but there is definitely less joy with the bigger sizes by all accounts. I suspect, however, that it will feel lighter and faster than the soul, which is the obvious approach as it gets going seriously early on the 633.

Another massive positive with the peaks is the launch / landing and the general feeling of safety that you have. I was kiting at a venue that requires walking through some beach huts (plenty of space - not as bad as that sounds) down a hill. Inevitably a bit turbulent. The peak is deeper in the window and sits there like a rock whereas the soul is much better into the wind so you are much more worried about it overflying. It has never happened to me, so not a massive concern, but I did enjoy the 100% sense of safety. I would also be happy self landing in high winds with the peak. Just pile it into the ground at the end of the window as there is no trapped air, so they are tough as old boots.

As you can probably tell, I am in love with the peaks. I haven't been so excited about anything kit wise since I started to foil. They are definitely not the kite to use unless you are on a foil board, but they feel perfect for that.
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