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Flysurfer Peak 4

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jumptheshark
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jumptheshark » Wed Jul 22, 2020 1:06 am

I cant believe you got that back up! Kudos for effort dude. That was a floppy crash for sure. Mostly due to the fact you let the bar all the way out. Let it crash on purpose like that and I bet it gets floppy every time! Crash holding the bar and your far more likely to get a straightforward LE down that holds shape or a wingtip drag to drop on either LE or flat onto its back. Both recoverable if you know which one your dealing with. You get flippy floppy like that and all bets are off until you do a reset. No one said this is a water kite for everyone, but you've just shown that even being new to it, with a little persistence you can get it back up from a near worst case scenario. A little practice and you will pull it off on the first reset.


My thoughts:

That whole guesswork section at the beginning was time wasted. If you're not sure how the kite is oriented and don't luck into something after 30 sec, its a reset. The more you mess around with it tensioned as a sea anchor the more water logged the kite and the messier the bridle. Decide quickly and swim to it while wrapping with as little tension in the lines as possible. It looked like you pulled the kite to you as you wrapped, which makes for uneven tension in lines being wrapped and a much harder unwrap. Swim to it arms over your board kicking like its a kick board, wrapping well with the goal of setting up a clean unwrap. It was windy enough to make everything a challenge, but the key is to get it sorted and onto its back with ZERO line tension. You cant open it up and let it out from there. For sure open it up while holding near the LE of both tips so you can make sure the bridles are not wrapped around the back, but then close it again, tip to tip and get it flat on the water. Then let out wraps of line from the bar to get the whole bridle out and a few more wraps of flying line to provide the needed slack. Hold up the top tip enough for it to catch, fill and then let it go. It should flop out straight downwind with you holding the upwind tip, Bridles all on the TE side. Then its a matter of pulling the upwind tip toward you an arms length at a time and flopping it to the side to get the kite oriented properly to catch wind, still with no tension on the bridle lines, especially the rears. With no tension it should stay flat. Then let the kite go and unwind fast enough to get the rest of the lines out cleanly before they tension and be ready on the fronts with one hand and the bar in the other to control the catch, fill, tips emptying and launch.
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PrfctChaos
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby PrfctChaos » Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:23 am

If i need to set the kite up for a deep water elaunch, I usually dont bother with winding up the lines. I just swim to the kite, set it up with leading edge up, swin back and launch. Very quick and reliable. I get very frustrated with doubleskin kites now if i need to swim them in or water reset them for a launch, so much more work than the peaks.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jaros » Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:51 am

PrfctChaos wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:23 am
If i need to set the kite up for a deep water elaunch, I usually dont bother with winding up the lines. I just swim to the kite, set it up with leading edge up, swin back and launch. Very quick and reliable. I get very frustrated with doubleskin kites now if i need to swim them in or water reset them for a launch, so much more work than the peaks.
What you do with the bar in this case? Let it float on the water, attach it to the board? Thanks!

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jatem » Wed Jul 22, 2020 6:37 am

palmbeacher wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:53 pm
merl wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:44 pm
Fair enough palmbeacher- good to show that they don't suit everyone. But I am having a hard time to understand this comment:
palmbeacher wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:20 pm
Drifting is ok, but my Drifters are imo superior.
You must mean something different to what I usually think of as drift. The magic happens on the peak when you ride towards it. I think that for most of us it is meaningless to compare how it does this with a regular tube kite. But you are an experienced foiler so I guess you mean something else when you say that your cabrinha is superior... Can you elaborate?
Sure, should have been more precise: for me the kite acceleration and deceleration is not as fast and precise as with the Drifter. Could be because I took it out for the first time, but I noticed a big difference.

One other element could be that I ride a 600cm2 wing (Lift 110). Perhaps the Peak4’s work much better with larger foils?
I'd recommend a few more sessions with the peak 5m. The first time I used one, I was underwhelmed, couldn't feel where the kite was, and thought it wasn't very powerful. I was oversheeting the bar, slightly backstalling it, causing it to lose power and turn unpredictably. As you get used to the required light bar pressure, you'll get more power and you won't let the bar out so much that it flaps. Since then, I haven't taken my drifters out of the bag.

Peaks don't crank with power when you head downwind (such as through a gybe). You'll need to get used to this, it's different and you'll need to ride over the hydrofoil. It allows you to ride swell without being yanked along by the kite.
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jumptheshark
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jumptheshark » Wed Jul 22, 2020 6:44 am

jaros wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:51 am
PrfctChaos wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:23 am
If i need to set the kite up for a deep water elaunch, I usually dont bother with winding up the lines. I just swim to the kite, set it up with leading edge up, swin back and launch. Very quick and reliable. I get very frustrated with doubleskin kites now if i need to swim them in or water reset them for a launch, so much more work than the peaks.
What you do with the bar in this case? Let it float on the water, attach it to the board? Thanks!
Have swum to Kites before. Leave the bar attached at the QR and swim ina wide arc to kite. Reset and swim back upwind in same wide arc. Just keep your bar in hand on the board as not to flip it through the lines.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby palmbeacher » Wed Jul 22, 2020 7:55 am

jatem wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 6:37 am
palmbeacher wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:53 pm
merl wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:44 pm
Fair enough palmbeacher- good to show that they don't suit everyone. But I am having a hard time to understand this comment:



You must mean something different to what I usually think of as drift. The magic happens on the peak when you ride towards it. I think that for most of us it is meaningless to compare how it does this with a regular tube kite. But you are an experienced foiler so I guess you mean something else when you say that your cabrinha is superior... Can you elaborate?
Sure, should have been more precise: for me the kite acceleration and deceleration is not as fast and precise as with the Drifter. Could be because I took it out for the first time, but I noticed a big difference.

One other element could be that I ride a 600cm2 wing (Lift 110). Perhaps the Peak4’s work much better with larger foils?
I'd recommend a few more sessions with the peak 5m. The first time I used one, I was underwhelmed, couldn't feel where the kite was, and thought it wasn't very powerful. I was oversheeting the bar, slightly backstalling it, causing it to lose power and turn unpredictably. As you get used to the required light bar pressure, you'll get more power and you won't let the bar out so much that it flaps. Since then, I haven't taken my drifters out of the bag.

Peaks don't crank with power when you head downwind (such as through a gybe). You'll need to get used to this, it's different and you'll need to ride over the hydrofoil. It allows you to ride swell without being yanked along by the kite.
Thanks! What about riding upwind at sharp angles without much effort?

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby PrfctChaos » Wed Jul 22, 2020 8:22 am

jumptheshark wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 6:44 am
jaros wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:51 am
PrfctChaos wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:23 am
If i need to set the kite up for a deep water elaunch, I usually dont bother with winding up the lines. I just swim to the kite, set it up with leading edge up, swin back and launch. Very quick and reliable. I get very frustrated with doubleskin kites now if i need to swim them in or water reset them for a launch, so much more work than the peaks.
What you do with the bar in this case? Let it float on the water, attach it to the board? Thanks!
Have swum to Kites before. Leave the bar attached at the QR and swim ina wide arc to kite. Reset and swim back upwind in same wide arc. Just keep your bar in hand on the board as not to flip it through the lines.
Yes, this. It just stays attached. The convenient thing about the peak is that it is not drifting downwind at any speed. So you can take your time getting there.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby drsurf » Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:24 am

palmbeacher wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:53 pm
merl wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:44 pm
Fair enough palmbeacher- good to show that they don't suit everyone. But I am having a hard time to understand this comment:
palmbeacher wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 8:20 pm
Drifting is ok, but my Drifters are imo superior.
You must mean something different to what I usually think of as drift. The magic happens on the peak when you ride towards it. I think that for most of us it is meaningless to compare how it does this with a regular tube kite. But you are an experienced foiler so I guess you mean something else when you say that your cabrinha is superior... Can you elaborate?
Sure, should have been more precise: for me the kite acceleration and deceleration is not as fast and precise as with the Drifter. Could be because I took it out for the first time, but I noticed a big difference.

One other element could be that I ride a 600cm2 wing (Lift 110). Perhaps the Peak4’s work much better with larger foils?
Hi palmbeacher.

I think you've hit the nail on the head when you queried your 600sq cm wing. In my experience when using wings around 600 sq cm, the Peak4 fun just isn't there like it is with a surf foil.

With my 65kg, a wing around 1000 sq cm, (eg. Moses 679), works great for me. A surf foil works at lower speeds without stalling, maintaining plenty of manoeuvrability and works well surfing waves. swell and even wind chop. Catching any type of wave, even small ones, is where a surf foil works and this is where the Peak4 also shines.

The drift of the Peak4 when surfing with a surf foil is unparalleled in my experience. You can be surfing a wave and there'll be virtually no pull from a depowered Peak4 and yet it stays in the air ready to power up as soon as you pull the bar in. I've also found that the upwind capability of the Peak4 combined with a surf foil matches that of an LEI surf kite.

Like any kiting experience, more wind = smaller kite and generally more fun. I can understand an 8m Peak4 in light wind was ordinary on a small foil. Much better on a surf foil but when you have wind for the 5,4 and 3m Peak4's with a surf foil you'll really have fun. The 5m has great range so if you can try a surf foil with it, you should get an understanding of why this thread is so popular.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby ieism » Wed Jul 22, 2020 11:33 am

Some good tips on relaunch, although I'm not sure i could pull that off with the 11m in 12knots. I've flown two days with a strip of pool noodle in the wingtip and two ziplock bags in the cells and it makes a big difference for me.
I'm more of a beginner at sea (and in general) and it gives me a lot of confidence and I also relaunced the kite in waves much easier yesterday. I used an elastic to tether the bags I case they fly out. If you crash the kite hard the bags pop open and prevent damage to the kite. Oversized bags stick better in the cells.


If Peak were to redesign this kite it would be fairly easy to make it float as the kite is so light. If the mesh wingtip inlets would be redesigned, and the outlet would be more on the trailing edge and larger it would dump water easier. I might do that myself.

The plastic sticks in the cells could be made thicker and out of foam, and if it would have two closed cells halfway between the tips and the middle you could more easily get it back up by raising that side in my opinion.

Its a great kite, but a few mods would make it even better suited to a total beginner like me. I basically went from not having flown a kite early this summer to riding a surfboard at sea with only a 2 hours lesson on a LEI. And this is a more affordable way into the sport than buying Lei kites, especially if your endgoal is to ride waves or foil anyway.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby joe f » Wed Jul 22, 2020 2:06 pm

tkaraszewski wrote:
Tue Jul 21, 2020 10:23 pm
That is amazing and you deserve a medal :-)

Relaunch is the only question mark in my brain with these kites (I have the 4m and 5m) for the foil board but knowing that there is potential for getting it off the water when the inevitable happens is very encouraging. I still think that it will be a very rare occurrence, due to the way that they fly, your video will definitely make me have a stab at relaunching it, although I think I will go for the 'wide arc swim' approach.


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