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Self launch and self land option

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tomtom
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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby tomtom » Mon Sep 14, 2020 8:36 am

Just do normal "no tool" self L/L methods. Flagout is always your last resort. It will be much safer in long run - than depend on this device :)

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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby Adventure Logs » Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:00 am

CARMELHILL wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 11:54 pm
Sorry you don't like it. I'm self employed and spend the weekends with my family. I always have to kite alone. There is never anyone around when I kite during the week. So I've had to add extra tools to my tool box to make life easier.
85% of the time I’m also kiting alone and 95% of the other times I will still solo land(most kiters still don’t know how to land a foil). I have no problem self landing without any tool or flagging out. There’s many different ways to do it. I rather not use something that at the very least will put uneven wear on my bridles and at worse damage my kite. It’s clever but imo unnecessary.

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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby joriws » Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:05 am

Flag-out with FLS is not necessarily safe for the kite on high winds. As during releasing airfoil might be producing a lot of lift and when other side of kite releases the flagout-side gets a lot of sideways stress to remaining anchor points attached to you. There are some videos where anchor points have been ripped away, or seam of cell opened.

So far the safest self land what I've done in high wind is backstall to ground from side of the wind window, walk the 4 lines tight keeping kite on trailing edge about span of airfoil then release to one steering line by letting go of 3 other lines. Works easily with gloves on too (snowkiting).

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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby SolarSet » Mon Sep 14, 2020 11:16 am

its doesn't give much confidence if test of this tool is done in wind speeds that backstoll method would work easy.

Never self landed my soul by if I had to in stronger winds >12kts would probably try to put kite on side and backstoll it like Jason is showings in his Adventure Logs video about selflanding.
Last edited by SolarSet on Mon Sep 14, 2020 12:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby mr-markus » Mon Sep 14, 2020 11:21 am

Never tried it but when i get the change im gonna try to lower the kite at the side of the window and pull the lower frontline in. This works for LEI also in very high winds, dunno if it works for the foil but hey! lifes a box of chocolates aint it?

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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby FLandOBX » Mon Sep 14, 2020 12:38 pm

mr-markus wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 11:21 am
Never tried it but when i get the change im gonna try to lower the kite at the side of the window and pull the lower frontline in. This works for LEI also in very high winds, dunno if it works for the foil but hey! lifes a box of chocolates aint it?
With an LEI, I often self-land by lowering the kite to side of window and pulling the UPPER frontline to land the kite on the beach with LE into the wind. I think you'd have trouble pulling the LOWER frontline of an LEI, especially in high wind. With a foil kite, I'm guessing you'd get lots of spinning and tangling with this technique, but at least it wouldn't be dangerous.

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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby mr-markus » Mon Sep 14, 2020 1:21 pm

if you pull the lower frontline the kite will turn in the U position and will stay there while you walk towards the kite hauling in the frontline. method with the upper frontline is way more dangerous because the kite can power up again when not commided enough to pull the line hard. this is for LEI only, did it with 40 knots gusts and worked like a charm.
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edt (Mon Sep 14, 2020 1:43 pm)
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edt
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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby edt » Mon Sep 14, 2020 1:46 pm

joriws wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:05 am

So far the safest self land what I've done in high wind is backstall to ground from side of the wind window, walk the 4 lines tight keeping kite on trailing edge about span of airfoil then release to one steering line by letting go of 3 other lines. Works easily with gloves on too (snowkiting).
What if it's too windy? For instance landing a 19m kite in 30 knots? In the Midwest it's very common for the wind to start nuking even tho it's not on the forecast or the radar. I end up pulling the qr and dealing with spaghetti.

Keep the ideas coming about landing techniques for foils guys. I really like the inventiveness.

In light wind any technique works

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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby Herman » Mon Sep 14, 2020 2:56 pm

mr-markus wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 11:21 am
Never tried it but when i get the change im gonna try to lower the kite at the side of the window and pull the lower frontline in. This works for LEI also in very high winds, dunno if it works for the foil but hey! lifes a box of chocolates aint it?
That is my preferred side for a front line flag out landing with a foil even though it does not turn the kite down with the initial pull and so if you are bold and quick I can't see why it would not work. I fly my foils on wheels and so not normally a problem backing down because you can ride towards the kite. Problem with pulling a front line is there could be a lot of line tension to overcome in real wind!
Last edited by Herman on Mon Sep 14, 2020 3:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Self launch and self land option

Postby joriws » Mon Sep 14, 2020 3:24 pm

edt wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 1:46 pm
joriws wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:05 am

So far the safest self land what I've done in high wind is backstall to ground from side of the wind window, walk the 4 lines tight keeping kite on trailing edge about span of airfoil then release to one steering line by letting go of 3 other lines. Works easily with gloves on too (snowkiting).
What if it's too windy? For instance landing a 19m kite in 30 knots? In the Midwest it's very common for the wind to start nuking even tho it's not on the forecast or the radar. I end up pulling the qr and dealing with spaghetti.
On my experience it works in any wind if there is no option but you have to land the kite somehow. It is essentially flagging to backline and with sidewindow backstall. Flysurfer guidance is to use FLS from the side of the window FLS-line is attached. If there is a lot of pull getting grip with gloves on on slippery lines is the hardest thing. Just twist your wrist for 90 degrees, just do not tie yourself to lines.

It is basically this technique I use everytime I need to solo-land on any foil kite I have if someone is interested what I meant in previous text, but I use all 4 lines in the beginning because backlines only could make kite fly TE first:


Another technique I use on deep powder is to slow speed crash the kite to very window edge, just take donkey d**k open before the stunt that you can quickly detach chicken loop when this controlled crash happens. Kite will initially go to taco position on side of the window. Then wind starts to push kite (and possibly rotate) to down wind. But before this wind push really happens - as quickly as possible, grab the steering line on which side you "crashed" the kite and start winding as quicky as possible the span of kite. After kite flagged you can more slowly pull the kite towards you and grab the fabric. Be careful with the lines that you don't tie yourself. Quite clean lands so far on deeper snow (upto waist deep I've done). You could in principle attach leash to same line you plan to wind but I've not done it. Also this crash technique is fine with wind shadow.


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