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Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

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abel
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Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby abel » Mon Aug 30, 2021 5:00 pm

Just got my Peak 4 11m2 and had a first session on 7 - 10 knots.
First time on a foil kite.
Normally using Airush ultra 12m2 for 9 to 12 knots.
I used same 24 m lines and, as expected, had some issues with the water start ( on hydrofoil Moses 633).
What woud be the downside using 27 m?
I'm wondering how many would prefer the longer lines...

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Re: Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby tkaraszewski » Mon Aug 30, 2021 5:26 pm

I'm making some 3m extensions to use with my 18m Sonic 3 for these conditions. That will lengthen my lines from 12m to 15m for light wind. I know, this comment doesn't really help you at all. :)

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Re: Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby Flyboy » Mon Aug 30, 2021 5:37 pm

I can't comment on what would work with an 11m Peak, as my largest Peak is a 6m. I tried flying it in really light wind with 3m extensions (meaning 26m total). I didn't find it made much difference. A knot or two extra made the difference ... & at that point I didn't like the slow, disconnected feel of the longer lines. My theory is: if you're too unpowered to get up with 20m lines, then the session is likely to be so marginal anyway that it's not worth going out. Again, this might be different with an 11m where you're not likely to be ripping turns anyway.

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Re: Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby geron » Mon Aug 30, 2021 5:53 pm

I think that 30m lines on the 8m Peak might make it possible to start with less wind; therefore, it is a good idea since it saves you having to have an 11 (or 14m meter kite), just extention lines. In those winds, it might make it eassier to retreve the kite in the water and swim to shore (and the slower kite is inevitable also in such light wind), In a 3m kite, I also like longer lines, since I like the slower moving kite and it makes them have more wind range (when it is not as strong)

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Re: Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Aug 30, 2021 6:06 pm

Your title suggest a broad question, but your post is very specific about the 11 m2 Peak4?

Anyways, I úse 28 m2 with the Peak4 in 8 m2, otherwise too little power.
29 m on my onestrut LEI 10 m2. I have sold now as same lowend as above 8 m2 and takes longer to rig.
30 m on my high aspect 11 m2 racekite (sold now)
30 m on my strutless 12 m2.
30 m on my double skin UL 15 m2.

And when I had a Peak4 in 11 m2 I used 30 m lines.

All of above was used in 5 to 8 knots so I can answer yes to all, always using longer than 25 m for sub 9 knots.

When I used LEI's for foiling I used 26-27 m lines for everything also for the small ones, but this was in more than 9 knots.

For Peak4 in 6-5-4-3 m2 I use the std 21 m lines, longer does not help, but shorter I havent found any advantages either.

8) Peter

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Re: Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby ieism » Mon Aug 30, 2021 6:49 pm

Are you looping the 11m? I can get up in 7knots but I've had the kite for a long time. I usually steer the kite all the way to the opposite side of the window fast and then back and get up when it races towards the edge of the window around 11oclock. The 11 loops pretty slow so I find I can get more speed just flying it back and forth with less risk of crashing it. Speed is power.

On a surfboard I never had to do this, but on a foil I need the kite to really shoot past me and pull me forward not downwind.
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Re: Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby geron » Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:50 pm

I can feel a lot of difference from 17m to 22m line length in a 5m Born Racestar+ (single skin) (similar to Peak4 but with higher aspect ratio) for low end. But I am not sure about the difference from 22m to 27m (or from 24m to 29m); I will have to try. I use it always with 24m lines now
Last edited by geron on Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby Adventure Logs » Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:52 pm

Long lines don't make as much of a difference on single skin compared to double skin foils.

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Re: Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby Trent hink » Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:06 pm

I messed around a lot with long lines a very long time ago. The fact is, the longer the lines, (If I recall I've tried up to 50 meters) you get more space for the kite to accelerate, but you also get the perception that the kite is much slower to turn.

If you mess with your line lengths and want to jump, it's gonna be frustrating because it will throw your timing way off.

For the peaks, I've been using and older liquid force mission control bar which has 20 meter lines with 4 meter extensions.

I have a couple of those bars, and I've messed around with 28 meter lines a bunch with the 8 meter peak4, and a little bit with the 11.

These days, with my Moses 633 and a weight around 84 kg. I can ride pretty easily on 24 meter lines with the 11meter peak4 in about 8.5 knots.

Below that, I can still ride _maybe_ down to 8 knots.... which is good enough for me.

My measurements might be relative, and I try to be conservative on my low-end measurements, but with the 4 meter extensions, I get the usual perception that I get a bit more power from the extra space the kite has to fly in, but also the feeling that the kite is sluggish in turning speed.

The kite turns just as it always does of course, and the change in feeling is from the amount of time it takes to move the kite to different parts of the flying window.

If you keep making the lines longer, eventually you will hit a point where it feels it's so hard to horse the kite around to the position you want it in, that it's just no fun anymore.

So you can get a bit more power out of longer lines, but there is a definite point of diminishing returns.

That point might be different spending on rider style, kite size (maybe really turning speed), and the wind gradient in the location (conditions) you are riding.

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Re: Who is using line lengths longer than 25 m for under 9 knots?

Postby TheJoe » Tue Aug 31, 2021 12:16 am

I'm not a big fan of using longer lines. Yes you can generate more apparent wind but you do have added drag and weight from the longer lines. If you have a solid wind line that longer lines get you in then that helps but that is something I have never seen. Usually you find that around 2oo or so feet from the ground.


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