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Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

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Raynski
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Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby Raynski » Sun Feb 27, 2022 2:22 pm

Maybe im just retarded, but ive lengthend b line as far as i could and the black stripes on the mixer test are still unequal. Hows this possible, am i doing something wrong?
Ive added pictures for clarity, what do i do?
https://ibb.co/mTC52C7
https://ibb.co/x1X1CQQ

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edt
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Re: Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby edt » Sun Feb 27, 2022 3:36 pm

when doing the mixer test, remember you can ONLY adjust b and c. A and Z can not be adjusted. Well then how do you adjust a and z? Simple! By bar throw. By moving the control bar in and out (or moving the respective front and rear lines in and out), this will adjust a and z. Then once you have adjusted a and z won't the bar throw also have to be adjusted? Yes! You will need to either 1) add pigtails to either the front or rear lines, or 2) permanently adjust the trim.

Once you have moved the control bar so that a and z are where you want, fix the bar at that point, then pull (you need to pull to adjust the mixers otherwise it won't be right), and then look at the B and C pulleys and start adjusting. Start with the control bar though that's how you adjust a and z. Why not 4 adjusters or even 3? flysurfer just thought this was a cleaner design I guess. when I add adjusters to a kite I always add 4 makes it easier.

The way that foil kites work is that all the lines shrink over time but the most pressure is on the A lines so they shrink the least if at all, and the least on the Z so almost always if you start from scratch you'll end up slightly tightening B and also adjusting A by trimming the kite and usually c can be left alone
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Raynski
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Re: Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby Raynski » Sun Feb 27, 2022 3:55 pm

Should have clarified my first post, i have done all of the above, i have watched fhe flysurfer mixer test video, fixated A and Z lines to 2 screwdrivers about 10cm apart and moved the black stripes on A and Z lines untill they were at equal lenght. Then i took the B line, compared it to A and there was unequal line length, then i adjusted the ring at B untill it could move no further and the inequality between lines became less but still not there, and i cant adjust it anymore because the ring hits the end of the rope as you can see in the picture i provided….

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edt
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Re: Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby edt » Sun Feb 27, 2022 4:02 pm

Raynski wrote:
Sun Feb 27, 2022 3:55 pm
Should have clarified my first post, i have done all of the above, i have watched fhe flysurfer mixer test video, fixated A and Z lines to 2 screwdrivers about 10cm apart and moved the black stripes on A and Z lines untill they were at equal lenght. Then i took the B line, compared it to A and there was unequal line length, then i adjusted the ring at B untill it could move no further and the inequality between lines became less but still not there, and i cant adjust it anymore because the ring hits the end of the rope as you can see in the picture i provided….
the c mixer also moves the b lines some (and the b moves the c lines some) Try adjusting the c mixer and the b mixer both (they are all connected with those pulleys). if that doesnt work add about 1 inch or 2cm loop behind the z mark

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Re: Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby jakemoore » Sun Feb 27, 2022 5:14 pm

You might find the sparepartline that runs over the pulley has shrunk. If so, that is the easiest line to replace. You might also find that the knot on C-Main where the sparepartline attaches can be moved toward the kite.

If the shrinking is happening in the upper bridle to that degree then there is an option to put a pigtail to extend. I would consider putting separate pigtails between the B-main and risers so that the tips and center can be tuned empirically.

Another choice is to stretch the lines. While that is a popular approach, my own opinion is that they will shrink again. Also there is a need to stretch the lines at every bridle and that may be harder to get right. For example there is a recent thread about using lasers to measure the bridle. The nice thing about that thread is that even if you don't want to invent your own laser bridle calibration device you can see the trends in bridle shrink from tip to center and take a pretty good guess about what needs to be done.

Finally it is important to realize that this is an old kite. In addition to shrinking bridle lines there is aged cloth, porous seams and lower internal air pressure. Resealing seams with silicone and laser bridle measurement will never make this a new kite. Because of the holistic changes in the age of the kite, the original mixer test results might not give the best flight for you, your riding and your conditions. The upside is with just a little understanding and effort you can make an old foil kite last a long time.

So my opinion is that the mixer test and long mixer test are a starting point but not an end point for tuning the kite. I like to tune the length of the risers rather than the upper bridle as an approximation that give a reasonable outcome with reasonable simplicity and respects the age of the kite. You may have to fly the kite 8-10 times in light winds to find out where you like it to balance faster vs stable. Start with a pigtail to extend either B main or even better individually BI BII and B5.

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Re: Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby jakemoore » Sun Feb 27, 2022 5:21 pm

Something like this:

The photo is labeled for C. But the same idea for B or Z. A 15 cm old piece of flying line is a perfect choice.
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6F7AB2A8-211B-46A7-9563-C5CDABF3B3B0.jpeg

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Re: Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby Raynski » Sun Feb 27, 2022 6:39 pm

jakemoore wrote:
Sun Feb 27, 2022 5:21 pm
Something like this:

The photo is labeled for C. But the same idea for B or Z. A 15 cm old piece of flying line is a perfect choice.
Thanks, really appreciate your input. It does look challenging, i have 2 left hands and im anxious about fucking it up. is there any way to easily only extend B-main with a pigtail instead of b1-b2 as well?
Last edited by Raynski on Sun Feb 27, 2022 8:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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edt
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Re: Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby edt » Sun Feb 27, 2022 7:49 pm

jakemoore wrote:
Sun Feb 27, 2022 5:14 pm


So my opinion is that the mixer test and long mixer test are a starting point but not an end point for tuning the kite. I like to tune the length of the risers rather than the upper bridle as an approximation that give a reasonable outcome with reasonable simplicity and respects the age of the kite. You may have to fly the kite 8-10 times in light winds to find out where you like it to balance faster vs stable. Start with a pigtail to extend either B main or even better individually BI BII and B5.
agree 100% When these foil kites get old, the mixer test is just a starting point. I still have to fly the kite 100 times afterwards to figure out how to finish tuning. Ok maybe you can do it in 10 flights but it takes me forever I'm still learning
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Raynski
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Re: Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby Raynski » Sun Feb 27, 2022 8:57 pm

What are the risers btw? Never heard of the term

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Re: Ive actually run out of rope to do the flysurfer mixer test

Postby jakemoore » Sun Feb 27, 2022 11:47 pm

Raynski wrote:
Sun Feb 27, 2022 8:57 pm
What are the risers btw? Never heard of the term
https://www.skynomad.com/articles/parag ... ction.html


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