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Wing surface area definitions?

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Axis1050
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Re: Wing surface area definitions?

Postby Axis1050 » Sat Jul 31, 2021 11:54 am

But when comparing equal design specifications eg Moses 950 initially quoted at 1600 now 1350 actual at the most. Area must be a meaningful consideration.

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gmb13
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Re: Wing surface area definitions?

Postby gmb13 » Sat Jul 31, 2021 12:11 pm

Axis1050 wrote:
Sat Jul 31, 2021 11:54 am
But when comparing equal design specifications eg Moses 950 initially quoted at 1600 now 1350 actual at the most. Area must be a meaningful consideration.
Nope. Manufacturers are only listing Surfance area because the customers think is means something. Once people start understanding that it is not useful for comparing wings, they can stop.

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Kamikuza
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Re: Wing surface area definitions?

Postby Kamikuza » Sat Jul 31, 2021 1:06 pm

Peter_Frank wrote:
Fri Jul 30, 2021 11:08 pm
Kamikuza wrote:
Fri Jul 30, 2021 1:51 pm
No chord or AR? Thickness is handy too, with all that you can make an educated guess about how it'll feel...

Snip...

You get width, chord and AR on rear wings...

Yes, span is also labelled, and max thickness and volume, on Gong wings.

You dont need (max) chord or AR, as it is implicit when you got span and area :thumb:

Eventhough they mistakenly calculate AR as span divided by max chord, which is totally wrong...
It is span divided by mean chord, meaning span*span/area equals AR.

And agree dwight, it seems silly to try to make a "Felt area" calculation, for so many reasons :wink:

8) Peter
Thickness would indeed be useful. Chord and span gives you rough idea of what the wing would be like, and a pre-calculated AR would save you making mistakes with your math.

It's all just information, only way to know what a wing is like is to ride it.

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Re: Wing surface area definitions?

Postby papasmerf » Sat Jul 31, 2021 8:13 pm

This is a great example of how Surface are does not work for comparing wings. The HA1450 has a lot more low end than its area suggest. The HA1450 is closer to the 1850R for lowend takeoff speed, and pumps a lot better. The HS1250 is close to the 1500R in Takeoff speed.

For Flat Water Inland conditions I would go for the HA1450. However, the HA are a lot more loose than the R series. So if you want a more stable and easy ride, then go for the 2200R or 1850R and wth new longer 700 Fuselage



thanks gunnar,, for wing foiling , have you used the new AF mast vs the original aluminum mast? is there a big difference,, is it worth using the new, stiffer version for winging? or will the old style aluminum work fine for the average casual winger?

also, i am having a hard time grasping the advantages of the R series north front foil wings. they act "smaller" than their size according to website but what is the advantage of that,,,why not just make a smaller wing that acts like itself and save the weight? does the bigger add some other benefits?

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Re: Wing surface area definitions?

Postby Peter_Frank » Sat Jul 31, 2021 9:56 pm

Agree, it is impossible to compare foil wings, as every parameter is important.

Even volume is not a measure of lift/drag at all, as camber and LE rounding means a lot more.

Apart from, as said, AR and sweep.

So the more numbers available, the better, and Gong is quite good at this, compared to many other brands.

But riding the wings, are only way to find out how it rides :thumb:

My question though, was solely, how other brands measure surface area:

1. Projected area.
2. Flat area if no dihedral.
3. Upper surface area.
4. "Felt" area.

As Gong writes the Felt area as the number on their wings.

8) Peter


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