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I'm not convinced (but want to be)

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TomW
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I'm not convinced (but want to be)

Postby TomW » Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:11 pm

I've watched tons of videos, read a lot here, and always curious and interested in new experiences. Been kite foiling almost 4 years and still enjoying it.
But I'm struggling to be convinced.

I have great open clean kite launches.
Open ocean.
But most launches are shallow a ways out, with wind waves breaking in those shallows.
Many spots have boulders/ rocky underwater and shores downwind of the beach or points with same.
When its over 15 knots there's a ton of chop.
Its often onshore wind.
If we have any windswell its nuking 20-30 knots onshore with short period shore break and several break zones.

Flat conditions its 8-12 knots.

I just can't see any way to learn in these conditions. I have seen one guy try to do it at my local spot in 8-12 knots. He slogged around and couldn't get wing flying. He had huge HF wing and 8 ft sup. I did see a guy in 25 knots at a spot this spring, but there was no way you could learn in those conditions.

To do this, I've read I need 15 -18 knots minimum. So I'll have to walk out and somehow get to depth that will take my 90 or 100cm mast. How do you get out in onshore wind if i have 50 meters of shallow water and waves pounding a 6 ft board with a 1m mast and have the thingawing attached to my wrist being washed by the waves? Somehow get up and paddle out over waves and then try to get up in the 50 cm chop and breaking wind waves from side of board.
I don't see videos of this. Learning in super choppy 18 knots onshore. I see guys in 18 knots on flat lakes. Or dudes like Gunnar who are super advanced who can already fly like a pro.

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Re: I'm not convinced ( but want to be)

Postby tkaraszewski » Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:14 pm

Go somewhere with sideshore conditions. Get a boat to take you out so you can "downwind" back to the beach.

Plenty of people who live near difficult kite launches had to travel to learn at beginner friendly kite launches. Maybe you need to do the same thing to wing.

Mossy 757
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Re: I'm not convinced (but want to be)

Postby Mossy 757 » Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:17 pm

It's a very valid question; when I consider what it takes to body drag outside the shorebreak in wavy dead-onshore conditions, it's definitely a hassle and that's with high aspect ratio kites which provide traction during body dragging.

The idea of somehow getting a wing + foilboard out to where I could waterstart through the shorebreak seems impossible on those days; without sideshore wind, what's the play? If the answer is a boat taxi, that sounds less self-sufficient than just sticking to kites.

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Re: I'm not convinced (but want to be)

Postby Trent hink » Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:28 pm

I'm no expert, but in dead-onshore with shore-break it is often easier to drag out and then start.

Sometimes in some places you can find a rip-current in these conditions. That is the spot to get out. It doesn't have to be a swimmer-murdering rip-current... Just a bit of help out through an area with smaller shorebreak.

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Re: I'm not convinced (but want to be)

Postby bragnouff » Mon Aug 03, 2020 11:05 pm

I think you just have to find spots that are more adapted to the realities of winging. All those spots that you've always dismissed for kiting, because the launch is sketchy, wind shadow inside, no room for setup, etc... they might work for wing instead. Maybe with a different perspective on your requirements, you'd find some great options around.
I think that's where the value is with wings, ride in places where kites cannot. To be fair, when riding on kiting spots, I still see the kite as having the advantage on pretty much every aspect (except the novelty).

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Re: I'm not convinced (but want to be)

Postby TheJoe » Tue Aug 04, 2020 2:51 am

I'm interested in winging but only for the tow in surfing part of it. I think well from what I have seen it's not a good replacement for kitefoiling but a different way to surf foil. Any way I just started kite foiling and waiting on a little more development time for winging it.

ronnie
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Re: I'm not convinced (but want to be)

Postby ronnie » Tue Aug 04, 2020 10:13 am

One possibility if you have shallow water for a long way out, would be to learn in an offshore wind, where you can get enough wind but still have flat water.
That would require a very short mast, so you could hop off the board before you got too far out and walk back upwind.
Slingshot seem to offer the best option for that, with a 15" mast (38cm).


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Re: I'm not convinced (but want to be)

Postby Peter_Frank » Tue Aug 04, 2020 11:57 am

When you have learned, you can most often (depending on your conditions) walk out till hip/chest deep between sand banks, and get up foiling parallel to the banks, so you can go upwind and conquer the low sand banks and breaking waves and get "out".

Works most often for me, but I use a short 80 cm mast, which gives a lot of benefit for this.

Otherwise, paddling out on your stomach, wingleash on your waist or leg the easiest, can quite often be done.

Indeed, eventhough a kitefoilboard is much smaller, it can be difficult as you have to drag out for a long time in the breaking waves, because of dead onshore winds and a low angle upwind when boarddragging through, so agree, not always easier than a wingfoil.

Everything depends on HOW harsh your conditions are of course :naughty:

If you are learning, you should not ride in these conditions, as you WILL lose ground the first long time.

8) Peter

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Re: I'm not convinced (but want to be)

Postby joekitetime » Tue Aug 04, 2020 3:31 pm

Funny, you sound exactly like me... a year ago...

Then I figured, what the hell, I'll give it a try.

I haven't put up a kite since...

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JakeFarley
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Re: I'm not convinced (but want to be)

Postby JakeFarley » Tue Aug 04, 2020 3:47 pm

The biggest obstacle for me is the cost of new equipment. I'm 6'2", 200 lbs., so from what I've gleaned from this forum is that I need a 120-140 liter board, 1600-2400 hydrofoil, and a 6m wing. Cost $3000+ new. Not sure if there is that much used equipment on the market where I live. Would like to demo or rent before I make the investment. I might contact a couple of local shops to see if they have demo equipment.


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