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Gear for best low end

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Dontsink
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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby Dontsink » Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:53 am

Abel Lago (ex kite world champ,now in RRD,70kg ) claimed in an interview that he could get up on foil with a 4m wing and 1250cm2 foil in...6kt.
It is all about pump technique he said.

I would like to see a vid of that, when i am riding 4m and the wind drops to 10kt the wing feels so powerless :(

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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby adriatic » Mon Apr 19, 2021 10:05 am

I saw that interview too. While I have no doubts he has excellent technique and can foil in much less wind than most people, his numbers seem a bit exaggerated.

But it does give a hint that, in winging, absolute low-end is much more dependant on tecniche and athleticism than in kiting. Gear is important, but not as in kiting.

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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby Dwight » Mon Apr 19, 2021 12:20 pm

Too big a board is just as bad as too small a board. A straight tail board is actually better than a chopped or bevel tail in light wind.

All big wings are not bad. Need to be very selective when selecting a big size. Some are fun, others to be avoided.

Don’t rush out and buy a big wing. You need to demo the big ones. Also, power is increasing with each version of some brands. Get the newest and best.

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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby davesails7 » Mon Apr 19, 2021 5:09 pm

adriatic wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 10:05 am
I saw that interview too. While I have no doubts he has excellent technique and can foil in much less wind than most people, his numbers seem a bit exaggerated.

But it does give a hint that, in winging, absolute low-end is much more dependant on tecniche and athleticism than in kiting. Gear is important, but not as in kiting.
Yeah, due to power being proportional to wind speed squared, it is hard to believe 6 knots and a 4m wing, at least the way I measure wind. It's very hard to measure wind speed accurately enough, and locally enough to really get a number on wind speed to compare low ends. I've found back to back testing is the only way to compare low end.

Good point, winging is much more dependent on the rider's athleticism. Top level athletes can generate a huge amount of watts for a short period of time, so maybe it's possible? I wouldn't have believed people can paddle a SUP onto foil in flat water if I hadn't seen the videos. Seems like <1% of people can do it, but it is possible.

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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Apr 19, 2021 5:31 pm

True, IMO it makes no sense to see what "super athletes" can do, in terms of low end, as they can pump without a kite nor a wing, once up.

For us mere mortals, it is a lot more interesting how low we can go with the right gear, being able to ride "easy" :rollgrin:

8) Peter

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Slappysan
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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby Slappysan » Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:31 pm

Dontsink wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:53 am
Abel Lago (ex kite world champ,now in RRD,70kg ) claimed in an interview that he could get up on foil with a 4m wing and 1250cm2 foil in...6kt.
It is all about pump technique he said.
But what is the point of being able to pump up on foil if you can't stop pumping without coming off foil? There are many videos of SUP foilers pump paddling up on foil in 0 winds, but it's not going to last long.

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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby adriatic » Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:47 pm

For us mere mortals, it is a lot more interesting how low we can go with the right gear, being able to ride "easy" :rollgrin:
Point is, even between "normal" wing riders, technique and athleticism can vary hugely, to a point gear is still important, but not the protagonist. Not nearly to the degree it is with foil kiting in regards to low end IMO.

Not saying the OP should not continue to look for suitable gear, just putting things a bit in perspective.
Last edited by adriatic on Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

adriatic
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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby adriatic » Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:51 pm

Slappysan wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:31 pm
Dontsink wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:53 am
Abel Lago (ex kite world champ,now in RRD,70kg ) claimed in an interview that he could get up on foil with a 4m wing and 1250cm2 foil in...6kt.
It is all about pump technique he said.
But what is the point of being able to pump up on foil if you can't stop pumping without coming off foil? There are many videos of SUP foilers pump paddling up on foil in 0 winds, but it's not going to last long.
That's not what Abel Lago said. He referred to pump technique to get up on foil only, after that a fast foil and apparent wind do the magic.

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Slappysan
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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby Slappysan » Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:09 am

adriatic wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:51 pm
That's not what Abel Lago said. He referred to pump technique to get up on foil only, after that a fast foil and apparent wind do the magic.
What does he weigh, 45 kg?

No way you can stay on foil in 6 knots of wind with a 4m hand wing without pumping the foil or the wing. Sorry, not buying it.

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Re: Gear for best low end

Postby Dontsink » Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:16 am

Slappysan wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:09 am
adriatic wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 6:51 pm
That's not what Abel Lago said. He referred to pump technique to get up on foil only, after that a fast foil and apparent wind do the magic.
What does he weigh, 45 kg?

No way you can stay on foil in 6 knots of wind with a 4m hand wing without pumping the foil or the wing. Sorry, not buying it.
He is 70kg.The exact gear is 65l board,1200 HighAspect foil (proto) and 4m wing.And 6knots...

Part of me wants you to be right ,so i will not feel so incompetent :)
But a bigger part of me wants this to be true,because it pretty much makes every day a wingfoil day :)

As for the technique itself he said it went like this:
-3 big pumps on the wing to get some boardspeed
-On the last one a big press on the tail (and then unload?) so the board will rise a bit on the foil.
-Inmediatly move weight forward and pump the foil ,keeping wing sheeted in and vertical.

He says a small Wing(sail) will allow you to use it more vertically without touching the water and that the key to all this is the ability to pump the foil up and away as soon as you have some mast out of the water.

As for staying up he says a small ,fast foil will create enough apparent wind.

Anyway, it does not really matter to me if he is doing this in exactly 6kt,8 or even 10kt.

The message i get loud and clear, is that getting good at pumping your board surffoil-style will get you wingfoiling without the hassle of a big Wing (I consider anything above 5m "big").

And i admit that most of the time i wingfoil and rise on foil "easily" i feel that i have excess sail area when up on foil.
So, something to work on :)


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