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climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

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Matteo V
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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby Matteo V » Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:44 pm

slide wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 8:35 am
a BIG SHOUT OUT to extinction rebellion this morning after they have held protests outside 3 of murdoch paper printing factories stopping production and delivery to outlets because of his refusal to print anything about climate change in his tabloids, which they don't

slide
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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby slide » Sun Sep 06, 2020 6:40 pm

hey thx guys , you know my posts contain so many true facts that you feel the need to repeat them , just incase some body missed them

Matteo V
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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby Matteo V » Tue Sep 08, 2020 3:23 am

slide wrote:
Sun Sep 06, 2020 6:40 pm
hey thx guys , you know my posts contain so many true facts that you feel the need to repeat them , just incase some body missed them
No, you just have a long history in this thread of deleting everything that you stated so I kind of wanted to preserve this so that we could " revel in the true facts" you provide us with.

slide
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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby slide » Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:16 am

worst wild fires ever in california, 15000 firefighters trying to control wildfires but they are out of control and they are expected to get worse
highest ever temperature in death valley ,over 54 degrees

Pemba
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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby Pemba » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:25 pm

Matteo V wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:00 am
Pemba wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 9:18 am
Just repeating something doesn't make it true. "a population increase is not environmentally devastating in a warming climate where food is available": what about extra CO2 emission (might as well do the same then) ? More plastics ? More (other) pollutants ? Overfishing ? The list could go on and on. I would say there is a strong negative correlation between population and environment depending somewhat on how you'd quantify each but generally true. But population increase in a warming climate might be better than the same in a cooling climate. I don't know. In any case do you see the reducing CO2 emissions advocated by the AGW "believers" leading to a cooler climate ? If you do then you obviously agree that AGW is taking place. If you don't, bringing up a cooling climate seems irrelevant.
I'm sorry, but I believed that this was a self-evident statement which is not debated. If you would like to debate it, then explain how increasing temperatures leads to less arability of land on average. In order to do that you would have to show that evaporation is greater in a cooler environment than a warmer one. You would also have to prove that food crops grow better in cooler temperatures. So, yeah, there is no debating it.
I'd not like to debate the CO2 part of your argument, just the other things I mentioned (plastics, pollutants etc.), from the way I wrote I thought that was evident actually. I think these things are the result of population increase and that they are devastating to the environment. Do you disagree ? If so then yes, I'd like to debate/explore that, maybe you can educate me on that. Although I'm quite aware that the topic here is CO2, not other environmental issues.
The other thing I had asked already, why do you keep on bringing up a cooler climate and its problems ? Are you concerned that reducing CO2 emissions as proposed by AGW believers might lead to a cooling climate ?

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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby Pemba » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:57 pm

Matteo V wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:00 am

Pemba wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 9:18 am
I don't think the left specifically wants to "import people". They want to help them. Naive maybe, and maybe one often leads to the other, but different from what you say. Also, certainly not all "imported" people have the ideology you described. Unfortunately caring about the environment, similar to caring about birthcontrol, animal welfare, etc. is a luxury. Not really a priority when you're poor. Though that's a bit beside the point.. It does seem that apart from a few indigenous communities here and there only (parts of) the first world show some care of the environment (while continuing destroying and after having destroyed a lot of it..)
No one is helped, in the long run, by increasing population. When we talk about the per person CO2 emissions, along with all of the other pollution that individuals produce in any society, one would think that getting the numbers down would be the number one goal. I mean does anyone actually think that we are making headway if we reduce the environmental impact of each individual on Earth by half, but we double the population? That should be simple enough math for anyone to realize that you're working backwards against yourself if you hold environmentalism and increasing population as ideals. And that is exactly what the left does! The problem with the left is that none of its constituents have the wherewithal to go against the left's propaganda on that issue.
I agree with you that an increasing (global) population is not a good thing and that it should come up in the CO2 debate (but doesn't really). But reducing it easier said than done. Do you have any proposals ? I'm not aware that "the left" has an increasing population as an ideal. If you refer not to an increasing global population but to an increasing population in "rich" countries, by "importing" people, I doubt it has a significant influence on the world population and the environment. But I might be wrong.

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tegirinenashi
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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby tegirinenashi » Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:41 pm

Here, in the land of snowflakes (California) the fires are so abundant, that it feels like the end of the world. The solar radiation in the early afternoon is typically 700 watts/m^2, while currently it is in single digits. There is simply no daylight!

Now, what is the lesson here, stop doing everything and fight global warming? No, as Matteo suggested, quite the opposite. This sunlight obstruction can happen for various reasons, and if, for example, supervolcano hit, there definitely would be a whole year or two with the sky like this -- a year without summer. Then, we are in serious trouble.

Civilization can overcome any problems given adequate energy production. And surrendering to climate zealots demands of "renewable" energy helps nothing. Guess what people in California are buying to isolate themselves from power outages? No, not solar panels, diesel generators. (Oh, guns as well, but for different reason).
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slide
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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby slide » Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:50 am

wildfires there now 10 times bigger than new york , and you say we don't need to change how we live , and if the wildfires arnt enough evidence yesterday many reports of very deep channels where warm water is flowing beneath the artic and melting even quicker than we thought
WWF reporting that many animals worldwide are dying out faster than we have ever seen before because we rape and pillage our resourses constantly in the name of greed

and quote me as much as you like so as to show others the truth -untill the power of love takes over the love of power, we have no hope of a decent future for our kids - you do have kids don't you

prop_joe
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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby prop_joe » Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:25 am

slide wrote:
Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:50 am

and quote me as much as you like so as to show others the truth -untill the power of love takes over the love of power, we have no hope of a decent future for our kids - you do have kids don't you
Well i don't(yet) so i think that currently puts you way way ahead of me in terms of carbon footprint... and yet you still claim the moral high ground telling everyone to change how they live? I think this is what puts the majority off of the climate activists, to busy shouting and not taking a look at themselves. It's okay though, Lewis Hamilton is going to save the planet by starting a racing team :lol: Wish i had a private jet to sell... f**king prat!

Matteo V
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Re: climate change / unpredictable weather/wind

Postby Matteo V » Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:13 pm

Pemba wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:57 pm
I agree with you that an increasing (global) population is not a good thing and that it should come up in the CO2 debate (but doesn't really). But reducing it easier said than done. Do you have any proposals ? I'm not aware that "the left" has an increasing population as an ideal. If you refer not to an increasing global population but to an increasing population in "rich" countries, by "importing" people, I doubt it has a significant influence on the world population and the environment. But I might be wrong.
Native populations of Western countries are naturally reducing their population by choosing to not have children above replacement rates. This is economically devastating to the banking system which exists solely on the basis of money as debt. The banking system that we have today, cannot function with a declining population. Other banking systems absolutely do work with a declining population, but are not seen as advantageous those who administer the current world monetary policy.

Thus immigration is both naturally and purposely steered toward importing people who will increase the population of Western countries. This increases the population of the World by immediately increasing the population of Western countries a small amount, and significantly increasing the population of Western countries by a much larger amount one to two Generations down the line. Second and third world Nations also gain more room and available resources for those remaining in those countries to increase the population there.

With regards to this problem, both left and right are guilty of furthering it. But the left, who holds environmentalism as a and ideal, is actually working against its own environmentalism with the importation of people who will increase the population. This is a large problem on the left because inconsistency of logic, or working against your own goals, without your own constituency calling you out on it, is "rule by insanity".


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