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Using LEI kites on land

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jumptheshark
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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby jumptheshark » Fri Jul 03, 2020 11:00 am

Definitely a smart minimalist start. For a stretch of about 6 years, I used a single 10m kite for 90% of my riding on both water and snow.
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Taron (Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:40 pm)
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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby Herman » Fri Jul 03, 2020 1:42 pm

Another thing worth bearing in mind is that it is very easy to go upwind on a landboard and therefore even tatty and well stretched LEIs are usable with landboards, where as their lack of upwind performance would be annoying on a TT.

Also you need much less power riding on a firm surface, and so, even small C kites may be ok once you have got some experience!

PS Wind quality is really important for a beginner particularly if you are trying to start with a 10m. Steady wind will make all the difference. If you don't expect steady wind I suggest you start smaller!!!
Last edited by Herman on Sat Jul 04, 2020 7:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby F-Bear » Fri Jul 03, 2020 11:13 pm

The Peak4 in 5 meter size is GREAT for landboarding. Highly recommended. Learn to fly it properly on land and then take it to the water. Keep in mind...Peak4 is OK with a twin-tip, but is really much more suited to a hydrofoil. At least in my experience.

For landboarding, I use my Peak4 5m in a grassy field and it is fantastic. Actually teaches you quickly how to fly a kite, since the flutter gives instant feedback if you are over or under sheeted. IMHO a Peak4 5m is a GREAT first kite for a beginner. Pair it with a good regular bar (you don't really need the Flysurfer bar) and all is awesome.

Finally....an LEI is fine for landboarding too. But as a beginner a couple crashes into hard ground will destroy your kite. Peak4 is much harder to damage. Also...you really need to understand the typical winds in your area, as this drives the proper kite size. It is no fun being underpowered on a landboard, nor is it fun being lit up. At least as a beginner. A 10-12m LEI may be to big for your local landboarding spot, depending on wind, ground type, landboard, and your weight. Used is for sure the way to go for the LEI, find a good wave kite since they are usually low or mid-aspect and handle gusts good and have good depower. I flew (my Peak is the go-to now) an older Switch Element3 9m, and it is perfect for me. Many other great choices.

And be careful...mistakes with kite handling on land can be very painful. Especially in the self-launching and landing phase. Again, the Peak4 is very friendly and shuts down fast when you push the bar away...so easy and safe, even compared to a good LEI. Go read the Peak4 thread, all 8 billion pages......lots of good info in there.

FB
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Taron (Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:40 pm)
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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby Taron » Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:43 pm

jumptheshark wrote:
Fri Jul 03, 2020 11:00 am
Definitely a smart minimalist start. For a stretch of about 6 years, I used a single 10m kite for 90% of my riding on both water and snow.
Thanks! Any tips other than to be a bit more careful with a LEI on land/snow?
F-Bear wrote: The Peak4 in 5 meter size is GREAT for landboarding. Highly recommended. Learn to fly it properly on land and then take it to the water. Keep in mind...Peak4 is OK with a twin-tip, but is really much more suited to a hydrofoil. At least in my experience.

For landboarding, I use my Peak4 5m in a grassy field and it is fantastic. Actually teaches you quickly how to fly a kite, since the flutter gives instant feedback if you are over or under sheeted. IMHO a Peak4 5m is a GREAT first kite for a beginner. Pair it with a good regular bar (you don't really need the Flysurfer bar) and all is awesome.

Finally....an LEI is fine for landboarding too. But as a beginner a couple crashes into hard ground will destroy your kite. Peak4 is much harder to damage. Also...you really need to understand the typical winds in your area, as this drives the proper kite size. It is no fun being underpowered on a landboard, nor is it fun being lit up. At least as a beginner. A 10-12m LEI may be to big for your local landboarding spot, depending on wind, ground type, landboard, and your weight. Used is for sure the way to go for the LEI, find a good wave kite since they are usually low or mid-aspect and handle gusts good and have good depower. I flew (my Peak is the go-to now) an older Switch Element3 9m, and it is perfect for me. Many other great choices.

And be careful...mistakes with kite handling on land can be very painful. Especially in the self-launching and landing phase. Again, the Peak4 is very friendly and shuts down fast when you push the bar away...so easy and safe, even compared to a good LEI. Go read the Peak4 thread, all 8 billion pages......lots of good info in there.

FB
Thanks man for your input! I will go for a 10m LEI at first, and obviously I am taking my safety precautions and use a helmet.

I am looking for a place where I am able to get a lesson to kite on land (as I've only done it in the water so far), but The Netherlands seems a bit scarce with this.

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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby Herman » Sun Jul 05, 2020 9:39 pm

Get some good knee pads. In a gust an experienced rider will be able to anticipate the power and control the line tension by sheeting out and turning towards the kite or sliding. The beginner option for being overpowered with the board at 90° to the lines is to roll onto the knees and do a knee scud, this is much better than holding out for a high side into a face plant. Personally I don't always wear a helmet but I nearly always wear kneepads. Crash shorts and jackets are not daft but they tend to be hot and sweaty.

Do plenty of static flying in low winds. As you will be using less power on land, kite trim will be more important. Learn how to find the backstall point for the prevailing wind strength as well as learning how to pull on the front lines to recover a backstall. Once you start riding remember that you can always turn up into wind to stop and practice using the QR so it is automatic. You have to get rid of your falling monkey instinct!

PS As a beginner it will be good if you can tune/trim the backstall point out of your sheeting range but it is not always possible for light wind and you must be able to sheet in enough to stop it overflying the window. All this will hopefully make sense as you gain experience!
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Taron (Mon Jul 06, 2020 7:03 am)
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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby Taron » Mon Jul 06, 2020 7:05 am

Herman wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 9:39 pm
Get some good knee pads. In a gust an experienced rider will be able to anticipate the power and control the line tension by sheeting out and turning towards the kite or sliding. The beginner option for being overpowered with the board at 90° to the lines is to roll onto the knees and do a knee scud, this is much better than holding out for a high side into a face plant. Personally I don't always wear a helmet but I nearly always wear kneepads. Crash shorts and jackets are not daft but they tend to be hot and sweaty.

Do plenty of static flying in low winds. As you will be using less power on land, kite trim will be more important. Learn how to find the backstall point for the prevailing wind strength as well as learning how to pull on the front lines to recover a backstall. Once you start riding remember that you can always turn up into wind to stop and practice using the QR so it is automatic. You have to get rid of your falling monkey instinct!

PS As a beginner it will be good if you can tune/trim the backstall point out of your sheeting range but it is not always possible for light wind and you must be able to sheet in enough to stop it overflying the window. All this will hopefully make sense as you gain experience!
Good idea! I was planning on using my motocross helmet (or buy a separate one), but maybe I should just wear my full motorbike gear at first. At least I've got plenty of padding all over me haha.

I am going to do a lesson for landboarding first just to get an idea of how it works. After that, I will start by just kiting without the board, and only if I feel comfortable with that I will get on a board.

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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby Herman » Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:19 am

A few padded up sessions make sense. Once you are riding one of the critical skills to learn is using the power to break out the rear wheels to slide and scrub off speed. Eventually you will use this for turning and sliding to toeside. Being padded may make the committment required to heelside a little easier to make. Your Motocross experience will no doubt kick in to make sure you fall lowside (heel side) rather than highside.

To put this in perspective I am a member of Padsarmy and so I am no longer pushing the envelope; I rarely fall or even drop the kite but if you just use your pads for real once every other season they are still worth it imho. Oversized T shirt over pads, who cares!

I will leave you in peace to get on with it - good luck Regards Herman
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Taron (Tue Jul 07, 2020 8:12 am)
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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby Taron » Tue Jul 07, 2020 8:13 am

Herman wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:19 am
A few padded up sessions make sense. Once you are riding one of the critical skills to learn is using the power to break out the rear wheels to slide and scrub off speed. Eventually you will use this for turning and sliding to toeside. Being padded may make the committment required to heelside a little easier to make. Your Motocross experience will no doubt kick in to make sure you fall lowside (heel side) rather than highside.

To put this in perspective I am a member of Padsarmy and so I am no longer pushing the envelope; I rarely fall or even drop the kite but if you just use your pads for real once every other season they are still worth it imho. Oversized T shirt over pads, who cares!

I will leave you in peace to get on with it - good luck Regards Herman
Thank you so much for your posts! It is greatly appreciated. I'm off to go and get a lesson for landboarding and read up on some good second-hand LEI kites to buy.

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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby hayes » Tue Jul 07, 2020 1:02 pm

Hey, take a look at these guys on YouTube, all British champion level landboard riding and almost all on inflatable kites

-Push Kiting
-Lewis Wilby
-David Ursell

And search ‘Essex kite park’ on Vimeo and search for the Trampa kite boarding team

Some of the best riders I’ve ever seen and a lot of riding on inflatables

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Re: Using LEI kites on land

Postby sflinux » Tue Jul 07, 2020 3:47 pm

I would buy a trainer kite. Then start looking for places to fly it. If there is asphalt, you can ride a skateboard. If dirt/sand/grass, then you will need something like a landboard, dirtsurfer, or buggy. Wear a helmet. Foil or LEI shouldn't make a difference, with the exception that LEIs are more fragile with hard crashes on land (but if you spend sufficient time with your trainer kite, that shouldn't be an issue). On hardpacked sand, my favorite kite to fly with my dirtsurfer is a 4M foil (unhooked). I prefer that over my delta shaped 7M LEI (unhooked). Find a kite that flies well with a bar (I am not a fan of handles). Using kites on land requires similar power to that of a hydrofoil, which typically use a range from 3M-10M in my area. Your area may be different, hence the advice of seeking locals is good. I would focus on your landboarding setup first, since you will most likely being using that most. Then when you visit snow and water spots, you can inquire with the locals to see recommended sizes for the area. No need to break the bank by buying new. Be a good ambassador to the sport, fly safe (Don't get hurt, and more importantly never put others in harms way).
Taron wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 10:56 pm
Is there a website where you are able to find land and/or snow kiter communities? Would be fun to meet up with a few people and get in real life tips as a noobie ^^ (I am in The Netherlands)
You could check out http://www.powerkiteforum.com/


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