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Low aspect open cell vs. single skin

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lederhosen
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Low aspect open cell vs. single skin

Postby lederhosen » Sun Nov 01, 2020 6:00 pm

There are bunch of diffent open cell snowkites on the market. While i understand the performance advantage of a high aspect kite or the versatility of a hyperlink, i am not sure what a low aspect open cell can do that a single skin kite can not do better.
Is it because some people expect a new version of a kite they liked or are there any real advantages of low aspect open cell kites?

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Re: Low aspect open cell vs. single skin

Postby gl » Sun Nov 01, 2020 9:19 pm

I think each brand has different characteristics. In my experience low aspect open cell kites are better at dealing with gusts, are a bit worse upwind and a little slower than higher aspect kites generally. That makes them seem worse but I much prefer them. I also have some single skin kites and find they have a bit less comfortable range and much more power per square metre. In high winds I tend to prefer the open cell kites and in light winds prefer the single skins.
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Re: Low aspect open cell vs. single skin

Postby Sojourner » Mon Nov 02, 2020 9:05 am

Low aspect open cells aren't low performance- they have a few intentional goals, such as stability and low lift. An Access or Apex is a pure bred kite.

Single skin NASA wings were the first primitive traction kites, but open cells (of any aspect ratio) were a significant evolution that made single skins obsolete. RAM air foils by nature are more efficient.

20 years later, enough market forces have allowed single skins to get R&D and have their place. It's not about which kite is better. It's about very different tools that also have a lot of overlap.

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Hardwater Kiter
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Re: Low aspect open cell vs. single skin

Postby Hardwater Kiter » Mon Nov 02, 2020 6:32 pm

lederhosen wrote:
Sun Nov 01, 2020 6:00 pm
There are bunch of diffent open cell snowkites on the market. While i understand the performance advantage of a high aspect kite or the versatility of a hyperlink, i am not sure what a low aspect open cell can do that a single skin kite can not do better.
Is it because some people expect a new version of a kite they liked or are there any real advantages of low aspect open cell kites?

IMO "Better" is the keyword here. What defines "better" is relative to what your wants or needs are in the kite. I would agree that in many ways there are very few advantages or disadvantages when comparing low AR open cells to single skins. We sell both and when a customer chooses one over the other it is usually based on what the kite was intended for and flight quality.

For example a customer may choose to go with an Ozone Blizzard or Access V7 over the Ozone Explore due to the superior flight quality that those kites have to offer. Qualities like smoothness, inherent gust handling, resistance to deformation in sudden wind shifts, REride safety etc.. . While another customer would choose a single skin for the power per size, its lightweight and light wind performance, it's durability, and generally lower cost and stunt kite like handling.

When we first started selling the Peak 1, it was a much more defined difference. But now the flight quality and design of single skins is much better and as such, they are really becoming more accepted. A huge advantage of the single skins IMO is the lightwind ability of the bigger sizes. Light wind is the most expensive wind condition to gear for and kites like the Explore and the Peak give you lightwind day savers at a much lower cost than say an R1 or Sonic. 12m is a big seller for us as a result.

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Re: Low aspect open cell vs. single skin

Postby bionicon » Mon May 03, 2021 12:38 pm

Hi all. Sorry if this thread is to old to dig up. But I'm wondering how much more a Peak4 13 or Explorer 12 single skin actually pulls compared to a Frenzy UL 13kvm?

I have tried higher aspect foils and concluded that's not an vi option for the kind of touring and ascent kiteing I like to do due to turbulente conditions and technical terrain.

Cheers Gunnar

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Re: Low aspect open cell vs. single skin

Postby kitexpert » Mon May 03, 2021 10:00 pm

Single skin has more static pull but foil kite has higher L/D ratio so it is more effective. You can jump high with Frenzy but not much with a big single skin kite, if at all. When you try to boost single skin kite it doesn't want to give you that boost. So it is quite difficult to say how much more ss kite pulls - usually more but sometimes less

Ease of use is one of the biggest single skin advantages.

Whether kite is open or closed celled is not so significant for efficiency. Some have thought open cell kites are "stronger" than closed cell kites but it is incorrect.

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Re: Low aspect open cell vs. single skin

Postby bionicon » Tue May 04, 2021 8:40 am

The reason I ask is mainly to increase low wind range below my Frenzy 13 UL . Would be nice with something that jumps ok.. But I wouldn't like to sacrifice any stability and ease of use and starting in no wind compared to my UL


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