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Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

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Flyboy
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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby Flyboy » Wed May 15, 2019 6:26 pm

Exal wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 5:46 pm
tautologies wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:58 pm
OP what you describe is how I use my Pivots. Jumping and waves. Not sure if i believe the any kite smokes the pivot in drift as even kites built specifically for it are just marginally better.

I think you'll hear people who has north kites recommended their kites and people who has naish kites recommended their kite because they are both great kites. The pivots power can be turned off and it's really responsive in waves. How do you usually ride waves? With drifting the kite or turning a lot?

I terms of boost, pivot won the red bull king of the air so that should not be a hard discussion.
You saying that the pivot is better in waves than the neo? You make this statement about brand bias but your reply is the only one here with it. Hm.
I don't read Taut stating the Pivot is better in waves than the Neo. Pivot is indisputably a big boosting kite ... that also works pretty well in waves. It's not, however, a "dedicated wave kite". I suspect the Neo is a bit more wave oriented than the Pivot ... but I've never actually flown a Neo.

"Does the pivot cater the freeride more [more boost and hangtime] and the neo a bit less but better drifting and less powerfull? "

I would say the answer is: yes.
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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby tautologies » Wed May 15, 2019 8:01 pm

Exal wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 5:46 pm
You saying that the pivot is better in waves than the neo? You make this statement about brand bias but your reply is the only one here with it. Hm.
Nope. I have not ridden any of the later versions of the Neo (I tried the 2 or 3 first version) so I would not know...but I doubt that smoke is a characterization I would believe, knowing how well the pivot drifts. I think the pivot is great in waves. Its a gust eating machine that happens to be super fast turning for its power.

What I did say is the people in this thread recommend the kites they ride because they are all good kites.

I'd agree with matth, but I try to stay with the kites OP was asking for. :thumb:
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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby Flyboy » Wed May 15, 2019 8:44 pm

I ride Cabos. They are "dedicated wave kites". I have also ridden a 10m Pivot in waves. I would choose my 11m Cabo over the 10m Pivot for wave riding any day. However, Cabos suck for jumping, whereas the Pivot is great for jumping & also surprisingly fast turning for kiting in waves. I really think it's not realistic to expect one kite to do everything well. My guess is that the Evo is a little more free-ridey than the Pivot, the Pivot is little more wavey than the Evo, the Neo is a little more wavey than the Pivot & the Pivot is a little more boosty than the Neo. They're all good all-round kites with slightly different focuses. I think the OP already knows this, but is hoping someone will prod him to make a decision one way or the other.

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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby Eduardo » Wed May 15, 2019 9:35 pm

I have ridden them both (2018 models) and would put them in different categories. Neo should be more compared to Naish Slash than Naish Pivot. Neo and Pivot are both great in their category.

Pivots are great for boosting and as the name says, pivot turns. This makes them great for easy kite loops or waves that need a lot of kite action. Pivot downsides are they are not good under powered (need too much attention and I prefer to forget about the kite on waves) and their drift for true side shore DTL is just OK. Neo is much better with drift, still turns fast, and is a classic DTL kite. I didn't try to jump with it, but generally this style kite will sacrifice and will not give you that rocket launch feeling. My suggestion: sloppy or on shore waves and boosting = Pivot. DTL wave riding = Neo.

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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby purdyd » Wed May 15, 2019 10:51 pm

I can’t speak to the pivot which would be on my list of kites to try.

But as far as the neo and evo, I picked the evo for waves. I sold my neos.

I personally think some of the new 3 strut all around kites are very good in waves and have some advantages over the dedicated wave kites in real world waves.

Not everyone has an endlessly peeling wave with a lot of wind that they can park and ride on and even if you did, the evo and pivots and other 3 strut all around kites of the world still drift well.

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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby Flyboy » Wed May 15, 2019 11:36 pm

purdyd wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 10:51 pm
I can’t speak to the pivot which would be on my list of kites to try.

But as far as the neo and evo, I picked the evo for waves. I sold my neos.

I personally think some of the new 3 strut all around kites are very good in waves and have some advantages over the dedicated wave kites in real world waves.

Not everyone has an endlessly peeling wave with a lot of wind that they can park and ride on and even if you did, the evo and pivots and other 3 strut all around kites of the world still drift well.
I like my Cabos because they turn very fast even with the kite fully depowered. This means you can turn with minimal pull which I find useful in "real world waves" - ie. not an endless peeling wave. In comparison, the Pivot turns slower & pulls harder through the turn. I think, in the end, you adapt your riding to the kite you're using & become comfortable with what you're used to.

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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby matth » Thu May 16, 2019 1:37 pm

Some really good input from you guys...great stuff. I ride mostly small to medium side on waves, love to boost and ride powered up, hooked in. So the Pivot is working great for me, very happy. I am starting to realize the benefits of certain kites in the waves. I found that it's key to have tension on the lines just before you decide to loop or roll the kite into a powered jibe. In light wind you need to edge just before you initiate turn. My guess is pure wave kites like the Neo or Slash will turn quicker with less edging...

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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby alford » Thu May 16, 2019 5:20 pm

Taut is acknowledging that it's okay to love and recommend the kite you own and are most familiar with, nothing wrong with having an opinion on your own gear :)
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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby purdyd » Thu May 16, 2019 11:25 pm

matth wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 1:37 pm
My guess is pure wave kites like the Neo or Slash will turn quicker with less edging...
My experience with the evo and the neo was I could turn the evo quicker

Waves and breaks are very different and can change with the the tide or the size and direction of the swell. No one would blink an eye if you had different boards for different conditions.

Factor in different styles and I don't think it should be too surprising that one size fits all kite would handle all the surf breaks and all the riders.

I find that I prefer a certain feel in kites rather than adapting to the kite. When they don't match, I move on.

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Re: Naish Pivot vs Duotone Neo

Postby PAFF » Fri May 17, 2019 1:54 pm

Jvwesemael wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 8:01 am
Hi All,

I am really anxious to hear your thoughts on how these kites compare and then especially wave capability vs freeride capabilty. I read on the forum that the Pivot is very powerfull and that is what I read in the NEO as well. Although the NEO is put as a wave specific kite it needs to tailor to the strapless freestyle needs of pro riders as well. So are these kites a real close match, or are there clear differences?

Does the pivot cater the freeride more [more boost and hangtime] and the neo a bit less but better drifting and less powerfull?

Thanks a lot!

Jeroen.
The Slash and the Neo are wavekites. Both great at that.

The Pivot and Evo are freeride TwinTip kites, great at that.

What sizes are you thinking, the "true wavesize" kites are 4m2 to 9m2 IMHO, and if we talk 10-12-14m2 the crossover kites like the pivot, can come to town..


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