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looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:43 am

I would say that going with a 12 m2 LEI in 3 m/s is not possible if you are over average weight.

If average weight 75 kg and the right wing and board, yes it is sometimes possible in 3 m/s (5.8 knots), other times not :wink:

Rider weight is extremely important.

I would aim for riding in 3.5 m/s (6.8 knots) as the minimum instead, if over average weight and using a LEI.

To be realistic :D

8) Peter

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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby marekmk » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:40 am

100% one strut, I have taught with three from different brands and my favourite is the ozone alpha. its relaunch in low winds is phenomenal, no power spike when looping the kite, ie ideal for foiling. its the only kite that I have sweet dreams over, its just insanely good to play, have fun with...........at the moment I have a 4 uno, 6 and 8 alpha, and a 10 cloud which never gets used with a 12 mono that has been used once........in low winds I love the 8 alpha on 30 m lines

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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:47 am

Hmmm, we are very different here...

I would hate a kite with no power spike, as it limits its low end a lot :(

Which is one of the reasons why smaller LEIs and high AR foil kites are great for foiling in this respect (for me).

8) Peter

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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby Cefirmeza » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:28 pm

marekmk wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:40 am
100% one strut, I have taught with three from different brands and my favourite is the ozone alpha. its relaunch in low winds is phenomenal, no power spike when looping the kite, ie ideal for foiling. its the only kite that I have sweet dreams over, its just insanely good to play, have fun with...........at the moment I have a 4 uno, 6 and 8 alpha, and a 10 cloud which never gets used with a 12 mono that has been used once........in low winds I love the 8 alpha on 30 m lines
What wing do you use for the low winds?

I am 65kg and feel that my 9m SS sst is not enough when the wind drops. I use a SS hoverglide standard wing which is nice above 10knots.
I am in doubt if I should go for a bigger wing or a 10m single strut for the lightest wind. Which option would help more?

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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby Foil » Mon Jun 17, 2019 2:12 pm

mmm, interesting thread as I was chasing the same dream,
wanting to stay with lei kites as previous experience with foil kites on Ttips had put me off ever trying a foil kite again.

but,recently after two sessions in very marginal conditions on my best ever light wind LEI - the new 12 mtr Ozone Alpha, I was frustrated at not getting up on the foil at a coastal, but shallow (5ft deep) location with onshore winds, with annoying small shore break that extended out to sea for a long distance.
What this meant was due to the lack of a power spike on the lei kite in super light airs I was hitting the bottom and being dumped further inshore by the small waves,leaving no time to double or triple loop the kite to get flying.

You can imagine my frustration as my lightweight sailing buddy was using his 11mtr Ozone Chrono V3 ultralight, and making me look like a newbie.
on day three in the same conditions I finally gave in to his offer of using his 15mtr chrono v3 U light.
that experience gave me a sleepless night as I was wondering how to tell pauline I might want to buy a 13mtr foil kite and bar.
I did tell her, but traded in my 12mtr Alpha to sweeten the financial blow.
after 8 sessions now on my 13mtr V3 Ozone Chrono U light and will never look back to lightwind LEI kites, the difference from older circa 2011 lightwind foil kites is incredible, I can now start in waist deep water with a 101 mast, the power spike just pops you high and dry before the kite has finished its downstroke, and the range of the 13 foil kite is much more than I expected,from next to no wind to enough for my 8mtr lei.
will I ever use my 10 Alpha again or my 9 Reo?
and how do I tell pauline I might want a 9mtr Chrono v3 U light?
you might ask why did I not buy the 15mtr chrono, I was advised by my buddy who owns the 15 not to bother with that size as his 15 was only for Ttip use and offered no advantage over his 11mtr in very light winds on the foil, he is only around 68kg, so very lightweight.
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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby marekmk » Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:15 pm

Cefirmeza wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:28 pm
marekmk wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:40 am
100% one strut, I have taught with three from different brands and my favourite is the ozone alpha. its relaunch in low winds is phenomenal, no power spike when looping the kite, ie ideal for foiling. its the only kite that I have sweet dreams over, its just insanely good to play, have fun with...........at the moment I have a 4 uno, 6 and 8 alpha, and a 10 cloud which never gets used with a 12 mono that has been used once........in low winds I love the 8 alpha on 30 m lines
What wing do you use for the low winds?

I am 65kg and feel that my 9m SS sst is not enough when the wind drops. I use a SS hoverglide standard wing which is nice above 10knots.
I am in doubt if I should go for a bigger wing or a 10m single strut for the lightest wind. Which option would help more?
[/quoteo]

I use the KRUISER LIGHTWIND by Ketos. in fact that its all I'm using but have three other wings. even in 30 +knots+ on a 2m old ozone uno
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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Jun 17, 2019 6:34 pm

Some thoughts on this, and experience:

Extreme personal differences whether you like a kite with powerspike, or a "soft" kite, but also depending on you and your gear what you typical will like IMO.
Both have their advantages, with a powerspike you got a lot more range, both highend and foil lowend, and you can accelerate all of a sudden when needed.
With a soft kite, it turns a lot faster and better, and you can pleasantly loop it around whenever you want, without getting yanked, and everything is smooth and easy, also a huge advantage and feels good.
Another advantage is when you gain speed, you dont get overpowered out of control, but this is a double edged sword as lower AR kites might still lead to a death run, compared to higher AR ones, depending on the riders ability to edge and move the kite to the window edge.

In general, just like LEIs for waveboards or TTs, heavier riders like more powerful kites both in grunt and powerspike, and reverse, lighter riders prefer smoother kites with less grunt (more depower), even when not using the same sizes of course.

We are talking about lightwind tubes here, and these need to be 1 or no strut to be light, in order to fly in 6-8 knots.
Thus they can not be high AR, and if, they would turn like dogs also - meaning powerspike not really possible with these.
Low AR has huge advantages in terms of relaunching also.
When more wind 10 knots and up, you can use ANY kite, heavy or light, powerspike or not - another ballgame here.

Going to high AR foilkites you can get max powerspike, meaning max windrange.
But you also get a really difficult kite in light winds, as it tends to fold easy in lulls or turbulence.
Meaning a bit lower AR kite can often be better for this task - again individual preferences.


Then another parameter, is wing.
If you use a small fast wing, say a racewing or just a small wing, the powerspike in the kite is even more essential, as you need it to get foiling, and when up, the apparent wind keeps you foiling in quite light wind, cool.
But transitions can be a lot more difficult, IF you lose speed...

With big wings, or big higher AR wings, you dont need the powerspike the same way.
Here you mostly just want to be able to waterstart, thats it, and you can foil now, and use the advantages of a soft kite :rollgrin:

So if rider is light, and uses a big wing, a smooth kite can be the best.
If rider is heavy and uses a small wing, powerspike is essential to be able to ride.

Above is probably basic knowledge for many, but maybe some can use it :D

8) Peter

PS: Jumping is not a thing that matters in this ultra light wind, right? Somewhat wrong, as hydrofoils can jump amazingly high in these winds, but here a high AR kite is required, even if it turns slower history has shown they give higher jumps, mostly because of less loss, but also because solely on hydrofoils the apparent wind angle get pinched too much if not efficient and high AR, and you can not jump high.

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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby Slappysan » Mon Jun 17, 2019 6:52 pm

If you really want to go that low wind with an LEI you should get the biggest BRM Cloud. Also understand that if you drop the kite you swim.

I would recommend going with a Peak 4 in 8m or 11m. Chances of dropping the kite are very low, but same swim if you do.

EDIT: forgot to mention the 12m Gin Marabou as another great option for you.
Last edited by Slappysan on Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby slowboat » Mon Jun 17, 2019 6:59 pm

Slappysan wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 6:52 pm
If you really want to go that low wind with an LEI you should get the biggest BRM Cloud. Also understand that if you drop the kite you swim.

I would recommend going with a Peak 4 in 8m or 11m. Chances of dropping the kite are very low, but same swim if you do.
This is good advice

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Re: looking for a new Lightwind tubekite Help!

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:22 pm

You could also go for the 12 m2 Ozone Alpha, as it is superlight, got 1 strut (easier to drift ashore in marginal winds compared to strutless), and is available in your area (as opposed to the strutless but superlight Cloud)

Could be worried it does not have sufficient punch/size to get you as low as you might desire, but this kite is a great choice IMO.

8) Peter


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