new redesigned LF Solo vs SS Ghost for foiling

[clydesdale]

anyone able to give feed back on these kites? Houston kiteboarding guys seem to like the new ghost but don’t carry liquid force. had early gen solo’s for foiling and were ok but not great and looking for a new foiling kite

[emmandkev]

I have a quiver of 6m, 8m and 12m Ghosts.

My reference points are 4.8m, 8.0m and 13.4m Cloud D kites.

First thought - why such a big bag! The kites can be packed down small, so why the big bag? A compression bag (aka BRM’s bag) would be fine. I’m sure that would save everyone some $$$

Build quality is excellent but the Ghosts are clearly heavier than their equivalent Cloud, although I admit I haven’t actually weighed them yet. Will this be an issue at the lower wind ranges - time will tell, but my instincts tell me that Clouds will deliver more when it gets light than the Ghosts

In terms of flying them the immediate thing I noticed was the turning arc. With the Clouds if you crank hard down on the bar the kite will spin around its axis regardless of whether you are sheeted out or in. This means that when charging down the line you can redirect the kite without worrying about it generating unwanted power. Not so with the Ghosts. Crank hard with the bar sheeted out and the kite will follow a wide arc coming out the loop with power. The first time I did this the power caught me off guard and I was catapulted over the front of the board. The solution is to sheet in hard while cranking on the bar and the kite spins on its axis. But this is a big change (for me at least) after 2 years flying Clouds.

The Ghost drifts as good as the Cloud. I had no issues charging down the line in 6ft swells. The kite stayed with me the whole time while sheeted out and was there waiting for me when I needed power to get back upwind.

One issue I did have (on my second outing) was that both the 8.0m and 12.0m Ghosts ended up with inverted lines when I crashed them. That day the wind built so whilst I started the day on the 12m by the end of it I was on the 8.0m. I managed to invert both kites twice. On all 4 occasions I put the kite into the water trying something new and on all 4 occasions the kite hit the water while I was still airborne on the foil, meaning that as the kite crashed my momentum resulted in slack lines. The kite then spun through the wind and the bridle lines flipped over the wingtips meaning that when I got the kite back in the air the lines were inverted. On 3 of the occasions the solution was simple, I simply corrected the issue by passing the bar through the lines. On the 4th occasion however the crash happened as I was spinning the kite and that mess was not something I could fix on the water and I can assure you that returning to the beach with the lines like that was not for the feint of heart. I’ve never had this problem when flying Clouds.

On the plus side water relaunch was a sinch - one of the downsides to the Cloud D is the absence of any struts means the canopy can get stuck on the water - the solution is not difficult but it takes time and patience. The single strut on the Ghost means this isn’t going to be a problem.

To sum up - the session I had with the 8.0m Ghost on Sunday (my third) was encouraging - pulling the bar in before cranking on it made a big difference. However, I still have a lot to learn about this kite so at the moment if I was asked to give them star ratings I’d give the Cloud D 4.75 (out of 5) and the Ghosts 4 stars

Laters

[jumptheshark]

How do the two 8m kites compare for low end power and range?

Thanks in advance

[emmandkev]

I don't really know yet, but I suspect the Clouds have better low end due to their weight (or lack of it). As for range again time will tell what the comfortable upper end is (for me at leat). If folks are interested i will update this post as my experience develops.

And for those wondering why I've made the switch if I like the Clouds so much - simples - Greg has refused to sell me any more kit. I honestly have no idea why. It's his decision, not mine. I wanted to buy a new Cloud E 8.0m. He rfused to sell it to me without any real explanation. If you can be bothered ask him - and I'd be interested to know his answer

[alford]

Yeah, I've heard that about BRM. Greg decides if you're cool enough to buy one of his wonderful kites. He'll interview you to be sure. Give me a break! Talk about arrogance. It's like some sort of club. I guess if you're dumb enough to put up with such BS go for it. It's simply clever marketing. Newsflash Mr. Maui, there's lots of choices available in light wind kites. I hope you have a plan B, you're going to need it.

[emmandkev]

Oh I’ve been through all that BS and have owned a quiver of Clouds for over 2 years now - I’ve loved them and the Cloud community. I’ve also tried to be a good customer. For example who in their right mind would pay more than the invoiced price in order to cover the PayPal charges? Me, that’s who. But this is not a sly attempt at bashing Greg, his company or his products. It’s simply to give context to why I’m now flying Ghosts, rather than the Clouds that I, frankly, love so much. I hope my comments on the Ghosts are helpful and I’ll update as I learn more about them. If there are any Ghost riders out there who have faced the inversion problems I’ve had I’d welcome hearing about your experiences

[purdyd]

Oh I’ve been through all that BS and have owned a quiver of Clouds for over 2 years now - I’ve loved them and the Cloud community. I’ve also tried to be a good customer. For example who in their right mind would pay more than the invoiced price in order to cover the PayPal charges? Me, that’s who. But this is not a sly attempt at bashing Greg, his company or his products. It’s simply to give context to why I’m now flying Ghosts, rather than the Clouds that I, frankly, love so much. I hope my comments on the Ghosts are helpful and I’ll update as I learn more about them. If there are any Ghost riders out there who have faced the inversion problems I’ve had I’d welcome hearing about your experiences

Are you in the United States?

Thank you very much for your interest in my gear. Its my great pleasure to give my full energy to the gear and to the riders that enjoy it. In order to be able to serve riders to my satisfaction I’ve had to discontinue international shipping. So even that your friend can receive for you in US my concerns are for the possibility of any problems with the gear when you receive it as well as any time later should it need service that I won’t be able to assist with internationally. So while I very much appreciate your interest and very much appreciate every rider that supports the gear I’m afraid my shipping policy limits my ability to be of service to you. I apologize for this.

[emmandkev]

I’m not going to discuss BRM’s sales policy. This is a discussion about the LF Solo and the SS Ghost. I’ll repeat that I only made my observation to put into context why I am now riding Ghosts and not Clouds.

[emmandkev]

Yesterday with winds in the 10knt - 13knt range I flew both the Ghost 12m and the Cloud D 13.4m. I flew both kites on the same bar and 27m lines. Both performed well but even though it is a bigger kite the Cloud D turns a lot quicker and with far less bar input than the Ghost. The difference is marked. When gybing, for example, cranking hard on the Ghost there was no way I was going to get it to do more than one loop. The Cloud D comfortably did two. I’m going to weigh both of these kites tomorrow but there is no doubt the Ghost is heavier, a lot heavier. What strikes me is the size of the leading edge tube - it must be twice the diameter of the Cloud D.

In conclusion I had more fun on my Cloud D.

[emmandkev]

Over the weekend I weighed my Ghost and Cloud kites. My measurements aren't exactly scientific (my bathroom scales aren't exactly accurate) so only offered up here as a guide:

6M Ghost = approx 4.0lbs vs 4.8m Cloud D = approx 2.5lbs (I appreciate this isn't a like for like comparison - I understand the 6.1m Cloud D = approx 3.0lbs)
8M Ghost = approx 5.0lbs vs 8m Cloud D = approx 3.5lbs
12M Ghost = approx 7.0lbs vs 13.4m Cloud D = approx 5.0lbs

Flew the 6m Ghost on Sunday - it performed well - I liked it. The day began with the wind gusting to 25mph but by the time I got to the beach the upper end had moderated to approx 17mph. I went out on my X22 foil and 20m lines. There were moments during my session when the lulls meant I didn't have enough grunt to get up from a water start, but once up and riding on the foil there was plenty of pull. We had some nice sets coming through the reef and down the line the kite drifted great and was quick to respond to steering inputs, even with slackish lines.

In fact my biggest issue of that session was a lack of water. We had a really low tide and I had to walk out a long way to find enough water to start in and even then there were rock formations and coral heads out there which have never bothered me before but were now effective foil traps.

As a result in the afternoon I rested my foil and went out on my twin tip - a Nomad Team Wave - and broke out the 12m Ghost on 20m lines. It was the first time I'd ridden this board properly in almost 2 years and after an initial face plant (too much front foot pressure!!) I had a great session wave ridding the 4 - 5ft swell in the Sound. The 12m ghost was great, drifted well, looped quickly and never once felt like too much kite. I also rediscovered the art of jumping and, although my timing was off, I reached heights I would never have achieved with my Cloud Ds. I, therefore, endorse, the review by Houston Kiteboarding in which they observe that this is a good choice of kite for someone looking for a one kite quiver for foiling and twin tipping.

The adventure continues...