That dude actually has some interesting vids, I just put him up because he was one of the few vids on topic....
Adventure Logs wrote:
Well that doesn’t make sense then because there’s been a big jump in performance since the Speed 4 days with the Chrono/Sonic and on. Perhaps you just don’t know that. Would explain why you Pansh is that great. You are comparing it to decade old designs. It’s all relative.
Ok so yes Chrono and Sonic are higher performance much higher in fact but how do they go wave riding?? Have you ridden waves with them? I have and although their performance is excellent they are just a little too high maintenance on waves. Speed series is the same in smaller sizes, but bigger sizes are fine. I might assume the biggest size of the race styles is fine on waves but I have never ridden one.
So basically if you want to compare the highest performing kites (ie higher AR) of other brands vs pansh you will have to wait a bit for the new Aeolus to come out. If you want to compare say low, mid or high AR then sure, there is the hyperlink, soul etc. Not many brands make low AR or even real mid AR. Other people have stated some kites from Pansh can compare to the soul, when using the jackomixer. I am a little skeptical of those comparisons, knowing flysurfer.
For certain kites improve they though have certainly not as much as you are alluding to. Foils kites can suffer horribly from tune problems and the information flysurfer has provided on the matter has not been complete or correct in some aspects though that has changed with time. So basically to find an aged foil kite that was flying correctly or well, has been almost impossible. People tend to just play pass the "not working right" kite around second hand. I can tell you that one of the worst kites for this is the Psycho4, but when it is flying right it is one of the best kites ever made, with a few changes.
Adventure Logs wrote:
But then to overcompensate and try to justify your choices on ridiculous claims is where I have a problem.
So I just want to bring up this quote from you. People do certainly try to justify their choices in life. One of those choices is why do they need the latest kite from a certain brand or to pay so much $$$ for gear. I am going to lay it out to you as straight as I can, 90% of this sport is time on the water. You having fun is entirely dependent on your mind and nothing else. Gear in many ways has truly not improved that much. Yes from brand to brand and model to model you can find big improvements, but if you look back through the years you will find kites, like the Psycho 4 that are still relevant. Look at Toby on old rebels or Horst talking about taking out the mosquito. Yes hydrofoils are amazing but to be honest I can have just as much and in many ways more fun on a surfboard. What is good about hydrofoils? They give you much more time on the water, remember that 90% bit?
One has to wonder if you, deniska and anyone else invading this thread are not just trying to justify your own choices. But hey I welcome any conversation. And yes I do know I post about Pansh everywhere and shit talk other gear, like duotone's lines etc.
I do have concern for the industry, the fact it hasn't gotten over the chickenloop is a worrying sign. I do like flysurfer, but I am sorry to say they won't survive someone like Pansh if they make kites as good or better than them and undercut on price as they are. Most brands would fold or be forced to compete if even one of the majors went direct and cut standard prices in half. I know exactly what brands pay for kites and what you can get them for. I think beginners being corralled, into handing over all the money for instructors, resellers, brands, pros and pimps is really really not fair and is why so many people are not taking up the sport. Maybe some people like less people in the sport. They are achieving the goal.
Adventure Logs wrote:
You do realize there’s a huge difference in manufacturing that comes out of China right?
Certainly and it would be great if Pansh changed some things. It would also be great if all the major brands changed some things too, like stopped making chicken loops.
Adventure Logs wrote:
Yes the manufacturing costs for Ozone or Flysurfer are much higher but you are also getting much more as well.
The manufacturing costs are likely slightly higher and you are only getting slightly more, the main differences is the overall design shape. The finer points are nice but not 100% necessary. A strong argument can be made that adjustable mixers are stupid and yes I know I have argued the opposite. People change opinions get over it.
Adventure Logs wrote:
I’m glad some think it’s ok to be dropped from 10m since it’s only water.
No, just not a big issue.
Adventure Logs wrote:
Pretty sure people have broken bones from that height due to quick release failures.
Well they had these problems not with Pansh didn't they?
So I am guessing you are referring to my often bringing up of Ruben Lenten. Few things. He was megalooping and much higher than 10m if I remember, you really can't megaloop well at 10m. You have done megaloops? Sure you have
You wouldn't be making this argument if you had wouldn't you
So megaloops have a huge downwind speed component. You end up basically going at the wind speed downwind, well at least if you do them right and the exciting way and you get a slack line falling moment, sooo much fun L-) To megaloop you really need 35 plus knots so you will be doing that plus whatever gravity will give you falling. You need the kite to catch you or well you can quite likely die. They are surprisingly easy things to do but the whole you can die bit is not to be understated. Add doing them in 1 foot of water or on land for even more excitement, I think it's the "you can die" factor. Would I megaloop a pansh kite, now? no fucking way. If I was younger may may maybe.
Some upgrades are highly recommended for that on them, like the A mains...
As to chickenloops, as shit as the Pansh one is, or at least the one they sent me, well I can basically guarantee it won't do what the piece of shit Ozone designed did.