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Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

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Tomlutz
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Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby Tomlutz » Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:46 am

Dear All,

there are a lot of reviews for sizes 5 and 6. But has anyone had the chance to fly both the Peak in 11 and 13m and can tell how much more you gain in low end with the Peak 13, and at what prize (lower turning speed, handling)?

Thanks, - Tom (82 kg, Wing Gong Allvator 65 M 70cm)

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Re: Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby tomtom » Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:00 pm

13 - is newer design and actually turns faster or as fast as 11

Imo there is no point to go above 8m and there are much better kite for ultralight winds. This was issue was beaten to death here and i will not comment it any further
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Re: Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby haiku » Mon Apr 27, 2020 3:37 pm

Hi Tom I live in the center of Italy, in my home spot the wind conditions are often marginal. Before The Covid 19 lock down I had my first short session with the new Peak 4 13 m. I own a quiver of Peaks inclusding the 11 m. As TomTom said the new 13 m is faster in the flight window; the low end is obviously better and you can easily ride in 5 to 7 Knots. Overall I was very impressed by the perfomance of the new Peak, It can float in the air like no other double skin RAM air kite but in undepowered wind conditions the water start requires a good technique and possibly a bigger board. Once on the foil....bam, you are in heaven! Tacking is also difficult and definetely is not a good kite to learn this transition. I couldn't check the upper end but as you know this is where a LEIs and classic foil kites beat :jump: the biggest Peaks. Nevertheless in this first session I really liked It and I'm looking forward to riding again with It. In the videos below you can see two jibing training sessions I had with the 13 m and the 11 m.





Cheers, stay safe

Carlo
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Re: Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby Michaelr123 » Mon Apr 27, 2020 7:52 pm

tomtom,

do you mind linking to the forums that discuss these options for better light wind kites? I was also under the impression that am 11-13m peak4 is one of the better if not the best option for lightwind foiling kites.

Thanks,
-Michael

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Re: Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby Tomlutz » Tue Apr 28, 2020 7:21 am

tomtom wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:00 pm
Imo there is no point to go above 8m and there are much better kite for ultralight winds. This was issue was beaten to death here and i will not comment it any further
Thanks tomtom. For wind under 6 knots I have a 18m Concept AIr Pulsion - I have read the comments in the other thread. This is for wind above 5/6 knots and I hope to have a better solution

- for lulls (wind often drops suddenly here)
- for severe turbulences and difficult launching conditions
- easier learning transitions on the foil
- easier self rescue and drying of kite, if wind completely dies (I have enough progressed with foiling and can avoid dropping the kite accidentally, cannot guarantee for sure :D )

I understand that the Peak 8m requires rather 9 than 6 knots, so not an option for me. - Tom

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Re: Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby Michaelr123 » Tue Apr 28, 2020 2:49 pm

So let's say when its blowing less than 6kts, I'm going to go do something else. What would you recommend for for 7-10kts cruising? I was under the impression that an 11m (or maybe 13m) peak4 would be one of the best options. I too am kiting lakes with gusty, shifty winds, difficult launch spots, etc. so hang time through lulls is fairly important. at the same time, I would like the highest performance kite possible that will survive those conditions. is that a better way to phrase the question? I'm not trying to pick up a 18-21m foil kite.

I currently use an 11m boxer for lightwind conditions. Last weekend I was able to almost ride in 6-8kts with that setup. I wasn't confident enough to get very far from shore, and transitions had to be perfectly timed or else it was a flop. had to swim back with my 14m apollo as that was too difficult time the downloops for transitions. I was able to keep the boxer in the air almost the whole time, and I was able to reliably relaunch it when I could stand near shore again.

If I could switch to a peak4 in a 8 or 11m to get a little more security in these conditions, then I could actually get out and cruise on those glassy days from the boat or whatever. I would guess that's what most people are trying to accomplish with really lightwind foiling?

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Re: Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby tomtom » Tue Apr 28, 2020 7:17 pm

I start writing below comment and then i stop. I was in this discussion many times and every time it was agree about disagree. So im holding my promise not commenting any further


"Almost any kite have more performance than Peaks. Kite performance is L/D - lift to drag ratio. The lighter the wind the more L/D you need because you ride proportionally faster than wind.
I.E. you ride 12 knots in 6 knots wind - 2x faster and you often ride less than 20knts in 20knts wind so same speed as wind or even slower than wind. You need less drag in lower and marginal wind to be able go faster. Im not talking about racing speeds but just normal fast speeds - and this is even more important while going upwind..."
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Re: Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby tomtom » Tue Apr 28, 2020 7:24 pm

There will be for sure more hi performance single skin in future - higher aspect. Peak4 13 is actually little different kite than other Peaks - with more performance but still not quite for even moderate aspect closed cell. LEIs - beside lightest onestrutter and zerostrutter are totally unusable in anything below 8 knots or we have different wind measurement.

I dont have peaks larger than 5. I briefly fly peak 8 and peak 13. I like my 9m kitech FRS /moderate aspect CC - like hyperlink/ more in bellow 11 knts

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Re: Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby Trent hink » Wed Apr 29, 2020 12:39 am

The peak is easy to fly in any wind, but it has no lift. Compromises... There is always a compromise. For extreme low wind a kite with good lift is probably better, if you have the skills to use it.

The 8 i think is good pretty good, but some of the compromises start to become apparent. I have the 11, and it only gets me out in 1-1.5 knots less than the 8.

The 11 feels a bit big and slow, but it gives me plenty of extra chances to get out.

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Re: Comparison Peak 13m and 11m

Postby Janus » Wed Apr 29, 2020 12:20 pm

Michaelr123 wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 2:49 pm
So let's say when its blowing less than 6kts, I'm going to go do something else. What would you recommend for for 7-10kts cruising? I was under the impression that an 11m (or maybe 13m) peak4 would be one of the best options. I too am kiting lakes with gusty, shifty winds, difficult launch spots, etc. so hang time through lulls is fairly important. at the same time, I would like the highest performance kite possible that will survive those conditions. is that a better way to phrase the question? I'm not trying to pick up a 18-21m foil kite.

I currently use an 11m boxer for lightwind conditions. Last weekend I was able to almost ride in 6-8kts with that setup. I wasn't confident enough to get very far from shore, and transitions had to be perfectly timed or else it was a flop. had to swim back with my 14m apollo as that was too difficult time the downloops for transitions. I was able to keep the boxer in the air almost the whole time, and I was able to reliably relaunch it when I could stand near shore again.

If I could switch to a peak4 in a 8 or 11m to get a little more security in these conditions, then I could actually get out and cruise on those glassy days from the boat or whatever. I would guess that's what most people are trying to accomplish with really lightwind foiling?
In steady 7-10kts, 72kg, 700-800cm2 foil, I use Soul 12m on shorter lines. a stock Soul 10m needs 8 kts.
But then you add the "lakes with gusty, shifty winds".. I still use the Soul 12m most (it floats better in the lulls then the 10m).. lulls below 6kts and then maxed out within an eyeblink.. 15+kts..swimming and waiting for a little more wind and you can get it up again.. it ain't always fun and can be really tricky..

Interested in which size Peak could do the trick better..


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