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Sinker Kneestart for Low Volume Boards

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FLandOBX
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Re: Sinker Kneestart for Low Volume Boards

Postby FLandOBX » Fri Aug 07, 2020 7:09 pm

What is the advantage of using a low volume "sinker" in wingfoiling? The disadvantage of low volume when waterstarting is clear. And low volume definitely has advantages for a sport requiring the board to remain in contact with the surface of the water (e.g., high wind windsurfing). But for wingfoiling, this is not the case, and board volume seems almost irrelevant except during the waterstart. So, why use a low volume wingfoiling board (or why not use a high volume wingfoiling board)?

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Re: Sinker Kneestart for Low Volume Boards

Postby juandesooka » Fri Aug 07, 2020 7:42 pm

FLandOBX wrote:
Fri Aug 07, 2020 7:09 pm
What is the advantage of using a low volume "sinker" in wingfoiling? The disadvantage of low volume when waterstarting is clear. And low volume definitely has advantages for a sport requiring the board to remain in contact with the surface of the water (e.g., high wind windsurfing). But for wingfoiling, this is not the case, and board volume seems almost irrelevant except during the waterstart. So, why use a low volume wingfoiling board (or why not use a high volume wingfoiling board)?
Because this video is the dream and you'd be hard pressed to do it on a 120L wide/long SUP! But even 1/10th of this dream, for us mere mortals, the hope for wing foil surfing is to use the wing to propel into waves, then surf them with the wing luffed. Smaller boards allow for tighter faster turning and for more effective pumping, both of which will help to maintain speed, link sections, and stay up on foil. So basically the same reason why people prefer as small a board as they can paddle for surf foiling. My dream is to use the same board I surf foil on (5'x21"x2.75" 30-35ishL), but the realities of water starting it are still unknown. A friend has the Fanatic 5.0, which seems to be working and may be as small as realistic for middle aged punters.

https://www.instagram.com/tv/CBkl-Jgje7 ... _copy_link

juandesooka
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Re: Sinker Kneestart for Low Volume Boards

Postby juandesooka » Fri Aug 07, 2020 8:38 pm

I am starting on the journey to figure out the sinker board water starts. Below are a bunch of info videos I found, in case they help anyone in their attempts. There's quite a difference in technique between boards capable of knee starts vs those requiring a windsurf/kite/wake style water start.

Some of the tips seem to make sense, but not once on the water actually trying to balance on a tippy board and get the wing overhead. Actually many of them. ;-)











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Re: Sinker Kneestart for Low Volume Boards

Postby FLandOBX » Fri Aug 07, 2020 10:51 pm

juandesooka wrote:
Fri Aug 07, 2020 7:42 pm
FLandOBX wrote:
Fri Aug 07, 2020 7:09 pm
What is the advantage of using a low volume "sinker" in wingfoiling? The disadvantage of low volume when waterstarting is clear. And low volume definitely has advantages for a sport requiring the board to remain in contact with the surface of the water (e.g., high wind windsurfing). But for wingfoiling, this is not the case, and board volume seems almost irrelevant except during the waterstart. So, why use a low volume wingfoiling board (or why not use a high volume wingfoiling board)?
Because this video is the dream and you'd be hard pressed to do it on a 120L wide/long SUP! But even 1/10th of this dream, for us mere mortals, the hope for wing foil surfing is to use the wing to propel into waves, then surf them with the wing luffed. Smaller boards allow for tighter faster turning and for more effective pumping, both of which will help to maintain speed, link sections, and stay up on foil. So basically the same reason why people prefer as small a board as they can paddle for surf foiling. My dream is to use the same board I surf foil on (5'x21"x2.75" 30-35ishL), but the realities of water starting it are still unknown. A friend has the Fanatic 5.0, which seems to be working and may be as small as realistic for middle aged punters.

https://www.instagram.com/tv/CBkl-Jgje7 ... _copy_link
Inspiring video. Thanks for that one, juandesooka.

I understand why a wingfoiler would want to use a small nimble board (same as kitefoiling), but a small nimble board doesn't always mean less volume. I am not a wingfoiler but if I was, I think I'd want to use a small nimble board with a combination of rocker, volume and "foil" (i.e., placement of foam) that makes it easy to waterstart, but doesn't impede the flight characteristics of the hydrofoil. Maybe wingfoil boards aren't there yet? What am I missing?

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Re: Sinker Kneestart for Low Volume Boards

Postby juandesooka » Sat Aug 08, 2020 12:19 am

FLandOBX wrote:
Fri Aug 07, 2020 10:51 pm
Inspiring video. Thanks for that one, juandesooka.

I understand why a wingfoiler would want to use a small nimble board (same as kitefoiling), but a small nimble board doesn't always mean less volume. I am not a wingfoiler but if I was, I think I'd want to use a small nimble board with a combination of rocker, volume and "foil" (i.e., placement of foam) that makes it easy to waterstart, but doesn't impede the flight characteristics of the hydrofoil. Maybe wingfoil boards aren't there yet? What am I missing?
That is the new generation of wingboards. EG the fanatic one is 5x24x4.5, 75L. So knee starting supposed to be mildly challenging, tippy, but doable.
My surf foil is half that volume, so a knee start is iffy for regular folks, and water starts are only for high winds. And that's on the bigger side for surf foils, lots of people riding down to 4'x20", 30L.

I haven't yet used a dedicated wing foil, but I think I'm going to build a copy of the fanatic board, see how it feels. My hope is that it is a happy medium, lose some of the nimble feel of the surf foil in pumping in turning, but small enough to feel fairly agile, and able to get it going reliably, even in fairly light wind.
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Re: Sinker Kneestart for Low Volume Boards

Postby windmaker » Sat Aug 08, 2020 9:09 am

Just got myself a F-One Rocket wing 5'4'' to replace my old 5'4'' wingboard and the first 2 things I noticed was :

1) Super light (4.5kg/ 75l)
2) The mast tracks are further forward than on my older board. This translates to a more centered stance and less swing weight in the front. It is much more reactive and accelerates super fast. Althouth they are both the same length/volume and width it feels like a much smaller board.


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