BWD wrote:i bet rrd didn't make bigger sizes because they couldn't manage heavy fluttering and impossible waterlaunch...
it's a lot more likely that their LE and canopy shaping strategies didn't scale easily to 15m+.
Look at what the rrd and the trip have in common, contrast against the cloud and airush zero:
AR and canopy shape, LE size, bridle configuration tell the story.
By the way, if your kite is flapping, sheet in.
If you are a flyweight you don't need a 17 anyway (over 10 knots).
Or to put it another way, grow a pair or rig down to the appropriate size kite.
Riding all the time with a sheeted out kite is like riding the clutch in a car, it doesn't smell right after a while, struts or no struts!
well BWD, i see it again, if you don't understand your opponent try to discredit him. this was seen too many times here on the forum. mostly from the brand affiliated posters, but sometimes from ordinary posters too. i'd like to call them the stockholm syndrome kite owners. it is when you bought the kite, and even if you are not totally satisfied with it, you are still keeping to praise it! but whatever...
if you are out of sales arguments, please don't use the "beginner" or "stupid" kiter arguments. because you just don't really know who you are talking with.
since i'm 109kg of deadweight now i don't need to grow anything else to use the biggest size of BRM or RRD or Airush etc. it is vice versa, if you are the manufacturer of the big litewind kites, make sure it is for the real life user. strutless kites are impossible to make with high enough wing shape to make sufficient lift without distorting the kite canopy. that is why all strutless kites are very low profile wings not suitable for low wind riding for heavy riders. flapping or not! strutless kites in bigger sizes have very limited usage in terms of kiters weight and riding conditions.
same conditions were true to first generation of the switchkites product. now they learned their lessons - their newer kites have more wing profile (even if they previously tried to accuse everyone of not knowing what they are doing)
personally i can not understand why to manufacture those kind of kites at all:
-same low profile wing race kites are made with the weight close to the same size strutless kite, but without the distortion of the wing and much easier relaunch
-smaller sizes of strutless kites are only good for flyweight kiter for travel option, other wise it would be a disaster waiting to happen
-only advantage for strutless kite under 12sqm is the travel weight and nothing else!
as i see it only field of use for strutless kites is the kite schools in some really poor wind condition regions e.g. Egypt