Strutless Kites Cloud vs. Gong

[BWD]

Well everyone has his own opinion. FYI the clouds are supposed to be on 20-22m lines and 20"ish bars. I have flown the 17m on 25m lines a lot and that is nice for low wind but not as lively. In fact first time with the 17 on short ones it took me by surprise and I accidentally looped it once.
So, um, mine turn fast, and don't have any funny bumpy feeling turning. Only time I can notice anything bumpy is positioning the kite poorly and causing it to suddenly luff completely - when this happens I am just glad it keeps flying instead of other kites that overfly the window easily.
But it's all a matter of taste as much as tuning and skills, more so sometimes. After all I often have seen skilled riders who dont care much for each other's gear, but can still rip it up in the same session. C'est la vie

[Nem0]

Is here no french guy who can tell us something about the strutless gong kites!?

[jaros]

Dont know about Gong, but i have a quiver of Storm Voyagers and i love them. Great kites, great price and great service from the owner and designer Sylvain Peretti. I use them for hydrofoiling and normal TT freeriding. Did i mentioned they look beautifull too? : )
Greetings, j

[stevez]

I can only talk for the clouds, which I use for hydrofoiling. I recently picked up a full quiver of the new C.5s, and I couldn't be happier. I'm enjoying them more every time I fly them. I suppose I believed the hype, and was so impressed with what Greg was doing with them on the videos. Good news is this time it's true

I particularly like the 5.5, which has been the go to kite so far, it's just such a sweet kite, so nicely balanced. I'm sure I'll feel the same about the 3.5 once I get more used to it. It's so fast turning and a bit more of a handful. I've only taken the 8.5 out once, and it was in conditions that would have been unviable on any kite I've owned previously. When I look at the 8.5 in the air overhead it looks to me almost like a 10 (i.e. in projected area). Yet it weighs 1.65kg! As for the 13.5, I've yet to try it out. I'm in two minds whether I even need to keep it. The 8.5 performed so well in marginal conditions, that I'm not sure if I need the bigger size. Maybe it will be useful for kiting in gentle summer afternoon sea breezes, when nobody else is on the water.

Price wise, the clouds are quite pricey if you just get a single, but with the quiver pricing it gets progressively better to the point of being reasonably affordable (in relative terms, compared to what other kites cost). It still doesn't compare with gong pricewise, but this also depends on your landed cost depending on where you are. Not that it's easy to compete with gong on price for anything (just look at their sup pricing, it's unbeatable, and the product looks great - sorry for the digression).

No, it was trimmed right, the odd feeling came from the "bump" in the steering pressure when the canopy twisted. Instead of being a linear increase there was a distinct bump when the canopy twisted from a left cant to a right or vice versa. And, seriously, no one can really make the claim that they're fast turning.

I've found steering on the clouds to be responsive and direct. If you had it trimmed right (i.e. all the lines the same length) and still had issues with steering, I'd suspect that it wasn't pumped hard enough. The clouds like to be pumped really hard.

[sabraxas]

What about real upwind performance of the Clouds in light wind?
I mean, riding traditional twintip kiteboards, or flydoors. The upwind performace of the clouds compared to higher AR struted kites or foil kites.

Everybody talks about the clouds outperforms in waves and hydrofoiling, ok.
What about Formula race? i havent seen one Cloud in Formula Race.

[bigtone667]

What about real upwind performance of the Clouds in light wind?
I mean, riding traditional twintip kiteboards, or flydoors. The upwind performace of the clouds compared to higher AR struted kites or foil kites.

Everybody talks about the clouds outperforms in waves and hydrofoiling, ok.
What about Formula race? i havent seen one Cloud in Formula Race.

A Cloud is not a race kite or big boosting kite.

I find the upwind performance to be pretty good.

[sabraxas]

I had heard wonderful things of Clouds, rode it one time and i ve found that 17m Cloud has very little upwind performance in light winds (8-9 kmots) compared to another light wind struted race kite, the Ozone Edge. And it lacks of depower when wind picks up to 11 knots.

But maybe it was me. The cloud has a strange bar feeling to me.

[Starsky]

It really does take a bit of riding to start figuring out the clouds. You can easily oversheet them killing their upwind, low end and turning speed. They produce much better performance when you are light enough on the bar not to feel a lot of rear line tension. Most people coming form a heavier kite will sheet in to the point they can feel the most feedback in the bar and this is not where clouds perform. Light touch and a mind to maintain forward flying speed is the approach that will get you smiling. They are not meant to be race kites, so for simple VMG get yourself a foil kite. They are playful and fun in a way not many kites can match, but they do require some technique.

[sabraxas]

Ok.Thanks for the instructions. If i can, i will give them another try.

[pcloud]

I have a quiver of C.5 Clouds and love them. They do take some getting used to but they fly super fast and depower and relaunch extremely well. Upwind performance is good but not amazing. They are more sensitive than most kites to under inflation and bar tuning. If you don't inflate them super, super hard or if your lines aren't all the exact same length, you will not be experiencing them at their full potential.

I also have Greg's CCS bar and love the simplicity of the system.