Contact   Imprint   Advertising   Guidelines

Moses 2019

A forum dedicated to Hydrofoil riders
tkaraszewski
Frequent Poster
Posts: 204
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2018 7:03 pm
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Hood River
Style: Hydrofoil
Gear: Moses/F-One/Flysurfer mostly
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 9 times
Been thanked: 46 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby tkaraszewski » Thu May 23, 2019 5:12 pm

grigorib wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 4:36 pm
tkaraszewski wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 4:30 pm
grigorib wrote:
Thu May 23, 2019 2:09 pm
Distance between nearest bolts of wing and stabilizer
749 507mm
710 467mm
647 500mm
so it tells me I shouldn’t need two separate fuselages

Moses team, please consider releasing larger than 590 wing for 647 kitefoil fuselage, something 683s size or tad smaller. The wing can extend arrowshape forward and an inch back to end right before fuselage-mast front bolt.
Pair it with large stabilizer if you’d like to keep sales up but carrying two fuselages for people who fly with gear is a major hassle.
I think we’re well past the point of question whether kitefoiling needs larger wings as well. 548 was a first wake up call, 590 followed and I consider Gunnar who was the one clearing doubts and propped the demands on 633 for kiting :)

#needa683sfor647 :)
I'm planning to build a custom larger wing that mounts to the 647 fuselage, however my first design roughly splits the difference in size between the 590 and 683s (and is higher aspect, similar to the 550, but bigger).
It’d be cool to take a 683 (windsurf wing, without “tail” in the back) and CNC an adopter to 647 for it.

I’d say a large kitefoil wing should stay thin <20mm and be <1000 sq.cm in size for my 200 lbs. the major point for it - to be able to go slow and start in lightwind without stalling and without board having to touch water.

In my opinion 550 had too straight of leading edge line and to fight seaweed better I’d arrowhead it a bit
One problem with fitting the 683 or other "wide" wings to the 647 fuselage is the bolt spacing on the 647 is much closer together than the surf fuselages, you end up with no positive connection to the fuselage at either the front of back of the wing.

Seaweed isn't much of a concern for me, nowhere I kite regularly has much seaweed.

If you buy me a 683 windsurf wing I'll cut two 683->647 adapters and send you one. :) No idea how well they'll work, but I've got the CNC equipment and an aircraft manufacturing engineer friend, so I'm sure we could make one.Since the screw spacing is different, you'd screw in the adapter to the fuse, then screw in the wing to the adapter over the top of the other screws. It'd work fine, except for the aforementioned problem about the screws all being relatively centered in the wider wing.

grigorib
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1950
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Kiting since: 2009
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; Tawas, MI; SPI; La Ventana
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, Slingshot Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m
Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/105cm masts 590/683s wings, Tim's 36" "woody", Slingshot Micro 3'6", MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 5m 2018 $400, Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot SST 9m 2019 $625, Slingshot RPM 11m 2018 $600, Core XR4 10m $900, Core XR4 13.5m $980, Core XR4 17m $1075, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530, 2019 Slingshot Guardian 17" brand new $260, 2018 Slingshot Guardian 20" bar $190
.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 96 times
Been thanked: 131 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby grigorib » Sun May 26, 2019 7:42 pm

I promised I’d compare 483 and 450 stabilizers side by side. so I did yesterday with 683s wing, 710 fuselage, 105cm mast and my 36” woody board under 7m Rally.

Session #1 - 450 stabilizer shimmed with 0.9mm washer - felt pretty good. Proper foot position on the board
Session #2 - 483 stabilizer, no shim. Perfect and perfect foot position
Session #3 - 450 stabilizer shimmed with a 1.2mm washer. Perfect ride, perfect foot position.

Waiting for my proper shims to come in mail.

Conclusion - 483 stabilizer is amazing but has wingtips pointed down and prone to damage in shallows. 450 stabilizer is more compact, 45g heavier, has better, damage-prone winglets pointed up and it takes shims to get foot positioned right where they were with 483

I will also try to do another attempt of riding 683s with 710 fuselage and 91cm mast but 330 or 325 stabilizer when I get to OBX coming weekend.
I hope to see you guys on water
Attachments
7207648A-C049-4D52-B6AA-C6AA61862E6F.jpeg
These users thanked the author grigorib for the post:
alowishus (Mon May 27, 2019 2:31 pm)
Rating: 10%

max
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 574
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2002 1:00 am
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby max » Sun May 26, 2019 10:41 pm

grigorib wrote:
Sun May 26, 2019 7:42 pm
I promised I’d compare 483 and 450 stabilizers side by side. so I did yesterday with 683s wing, 710 fuselage, 105cm mast and my 36” woody board under 7m Rally.

Session #1 - 450 stabilizer shimmed with 0.9mm washer - felt pretty good. Proper foot position on the board
Session #2 - 483 stabilizer, no shim. Perfect and perfect foot position
Session #3 - 450 stabilizer shimmed with a 1.2mm washer. Perfect ride, perfect foot position.

Waiting for my proper shims to come in mail.

Conclusion - 483 stabilizer is amazing but has wingtips pointed down and prone to damage in shallows. 450 stabilizer is more compact, 45g heavier, has better, damage-prone winglets pointed up and it takes shims to get foot positioned right where they were with 483

I will also try to do another attempt of riding 683s with 710 fuselage and 91cm mast but 330 or 325 stabilizer when I get to OBX coming weekend.
I hope to see you guys on water

so if the 450 is not shimmed, how does the front foot position change in comparison to using the 483?

and how does the 450 change the ride . . . slower to faster, more carvy or less, and . . . ?

grigorib
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1950
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Kiting since: 2009
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; Tawas, MI; SPI; La Ventana
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, Slingshot Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m
Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/105cm masts 590/683s wings, Tim's 36" "woody", Slingshot Micro 3'6", MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 5m 2018 $400, Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot SST 9m 2019 $625, Slingshot RPM 11m 2018 $600, Core XR4 10m $900, Core XR4 13.5m $980, Core XR4 17m $1075, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530, 2019 Slingshot Guardian 17" brand new $260, 2018 Slingshot Guardian 20" bar $190
.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 96 times
Been thanked: 131 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby grigorib » Mon May 27, 2019 2:55 am

max wrote:
Sun May 26, 2019 10:41 pm
...
so if the 450 is not shimmed, how does the front foot position change in comparison to using the 483?

and how does the 450 change the ride . . . slower to faster, more carvy or less, and . . . ?
If 450 is not shimmed you’d need to step forward couple of inches or move mast back which I can’t do on either 36” woody nor 42” Micro boards

450 feels about same as 483 - I don’t think think it changes the ride. Great setup, don’t forget to shim it though

max
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 574
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2002 1:00 am
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby max » Mon May 27, 2019 3:02 am

grigorib wrote:
Mon May 27, 2019 2:55 am
max wrote:
Sun May 26, 2019 10:41 pm
...
so if the 450 is not shimmed, how does the front foot position change in comparison to using the 483?

and how does the 450 change the ride . . . slower to faster, more carvy or less, and . . . ?
If 450 is not shimmed you’d need to step forward couple of inches or move mast back which I can’t do on either 36” woody nor 42” Micro boards

450 feels about same as 483 - I don’t think think it changes the ride. Great setup, don’t forget to shim it though

thanks for that . . . I do not think that it is what I am looking for s keen to hear about how it goes with the smaller stab.

grigorib
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1950
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Kiting since: 2009
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; Tawas, MI; SPI; La Ventana
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, Slingshot Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m
Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/105cm masts 590/683s wings, Tim's 36" "woody", Slingshot Micro 3'6", MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 5m 2018 $400, Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot SST 9m 2019 $625, Slingshot RPM 11m 2018 $600, Core XR4 10m $900, Core XR4 13.5m $980, Core XR4 17m $1075, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530, 2019 Slingshot Guardian 17" brand new $260, 2018 Slingshot Guardian 20" bar $190
.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 96 times
Been thanked: 131 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby grigorib » Tue May 28, 2019 5:42 am

Looks like 75cm aluminum mast and fuselage to accommodate aluminum mast. Nice that mast is closer to the wing.
Attachments
C57AEA40-CB80-4EE8-A492-8106F5DFC42F.jpeg

alowishus
Medium Poster
Posts: 71
Joined: Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:38 pm
Kiting since: 14
Gear: ozone airush slingshot moses
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 16 times
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby alowishus » Tue May 28, 2019 11:42 am

grigorib wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 5:42 am
Looks like 75cm aluminum mast and fuselage to accommodate aluminum mast. Nice that mast is closer to the wing.
Another fuse???

grigorib
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1950
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Kiting since: 2009
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; Tawas, MI; SPI; La Ventana
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, Slingshot Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m
Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/105cm masts 590/683s wings, Tim's 36" "woody", Slingshot Micro 3'6", MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 5m 2018 $400, Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot SST 9m 2019 $625, Slingshot RPM 11m 2018 $600, Core XR4 10m $900, Core XR4 13.5m $980, Core XR4 17m $1075, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530, 2019 Slingshot Guardian 17" brand new $260, 2018 Slingshot Guardian 20" bar $190
.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 96 times
Been thanked: 131 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby grigorib » Tue May 28, 2019 12:44 pm

alowishus wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 11:42 am
grigorib wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 5:42 am
Looks like 75cm aluminum mast and fuselage to accommodate aluminum mast. Nice that mast is closer to the wing.
Another fuse???
Apparently

trod27
Medium Poster
Posts: 62
Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2012 4:36 pm
Kiting since: 2005
Local Beach: Utah
Favorite Beaches: Gorge, Los Barilles, Deer Creek
Style: freestyle
Gear: Slingshot, Moses
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 3 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby trod27 » Wed May 29, 2019 4:09 am

looks like my 710
Attachments
20190510_154231.jpg

grigorib
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1950
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:12 pm
Kiting since: 2009
Local Beach: OBX; Clinton Lake, IL; Lake Michigan; Tawas, MI; SPI; La Ventana
Gear: Kites: Slingshot Rally 5/7/9/11m, Slingshot Turbine 9m, Flysurfer Speed4 10m standard, Peter Lynn Venom II ARC 16m
Boards: Spleene RIP 37, Flysurfer Flydoor5 XL, Slingshot/Moses 80/91/105cm masts 590/683s wings, Tim's 36" "woody", Slingshot Micro 3'6", MBS Comp 95x

For sale: Slingshot SST 5m 2018 $400, Slingshot SST 6m 2018 $480, Slingshot SST 9m 2019 $625, Slingshot RPM 11m 2018 $600, Core XR4 10m $900, Core XR4 13.5m $980, Core XR4 17m $1075, Slingshot Turbine 5m 2017 like new $450, BROkite carbon board 140x44cm like new complete $650, Slingshot Rally 6m 2017 like new $530, 2019 Slingshot Guardian 17" brand new $260, 2018 Slingshot Guardian 20" bar $190
.
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 96 times
Been thanked: 131 times

Re: Moses 2019

Postby grigorib » Wed May 29, 2019 1:18 pm

trod27 wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 4:09 am
looks like my 710
Who knows what the length will be, but if you zoom into mast-fuselage attachment part it's obvious that the fuselage has mast profile CNCed to fit aluminum mast.

So yes, fortunately standard wing/stabilizer but different fuselage. If I were Moses I’d make upper surface flat and connection flush (and extra holes, or elongated holes - in "athletics track" shape) so people can bolt the fuselage to other manufacturers masts (which have different profile and hole spacing). Also with flush connection there’s less material needed in the fuselage so it could become thinner and lighter.


Return to “Hydrofoil”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Foil, Kitenuovoman, pilookite and 9 guests

cron